3.5 t Boat Trailer Upgrade - Leaf or torsion springs
Righto, I have a Yankie Magic Tilt Ali 3.1 t rated dual axle trailer with leaf springs, dual 1.55 t axles, UFP disc brakes and Ford 5 bolt hubs and 14 inch wheels.
Is 4 years old and has served me well, I have done nothing but grease the hubs and wash her down well. Tows well.
Boat is 235 Boston Whaler Conquest, a bit of a fattie so boat on trailer will be closing in on 3t and I am possibly over with full fuel and water.
Taking her up to Exxy in April with Bodie, and the springs and rotors are rusty and need replacement......now the bad news.
Whilst I got the trailer bloody cheap (A$5,200 brand new in the US), getting parts in Aus is hard.....options are:
1. Buy replacement springs, new rotors and hubs, new callipers (not much more than getting new pads and bolts). About A$1,000 plus freiht from the US. No idea of freight yet, waiting for a quote. Heavy springs could burn!
2. Get new Aus spec leaf springs and modify to suit, should be able to get bearings and rotors from Us at reasonable price.
3. Upgrade the whole rolling stock to torsion axles, but this will need me to go to 2.5 t axles to get a rating above what I have now (you need to de-rate torsion axles as they are not load sharing) and this will need bigger bearings, 15 inch rims and tyres and callipers. May as well spec everything to 3.5 t. With new rims and tyres this will all add up!!
Rob H's retrospective recommendation in the ended was No. 3 as I recall (although he actually went with leafs because of the load sharing) and Bodie went dual 2.5 t torsions and new rims for his Fury.
Possibly a lot more money......but likely safer.
EXCEPT, torsion springs don't load share like leafs, which is their only major negative from what I can tell with dual axle set ups and large loads.
Any recommendations and/or manufacturers.... I can do all the work myself, can weld etc so none of that is an issue.
Will head to Martins and Tow Safe and get some quotes, other suggestions (happy to order from interstate if needed) welcome.
Cheers
Boston Whaler 235 Conquest......getting the flogging it was built for.
scano
Posts: 1246
Date Joined: 31/05/07
Hey john
What about getting some springs made locally the same as what you currently have (could add more leaves if needed) and then get them galvanised.
Would work out far cheaper than reinventing the wheel. There was a company in kewdale who made springs to order who were reasonably priced.
then just get the bearings and races from the us and away you go. Just make sure the axles themselves are in reasonable condition. Stub axles broken on the side of the road aren't much fun!
holth
Posts: 812
Date Joined: 09/10/06
trailersparesdirect.com.au
trailersparesdirect.com.au for all your yanky parts john. There in QLD.
Scotte
Posts: 1142
Date Joined: 07/12/06
Only 4 yesrs on Springs and
Only 4 yesrs on Springs and rotors aye. That's not very long service life for those parts.
scano
Posts: 1246
Date Joined: 31/05/07
True maggot
But not sure any of us would last too long lugging 3 tonne and being soaked in salt water so regularly.
leaf springs are good for 4-5 years max in saltwater environments. The salt sites between the leaves and they corrode to the point where they swell up and then break all of a sudden.
Rob H
Posts: 5744
Date Joined: 18/01/12
My springs I bought from
My springs I bought from Bigmantrailers as Martins were out.
Turns out they are not gal but more like silver paint.
3 years and Im sniffing for replacements
Give a man a mask, and he'll show you his true face...
The older you get the more you realize that no one has a f++king clue what they're doing.
Everyone's just winging it.
Cruise Control
Posts: 970
Date Joined: 03/11/10
John Some input from me. My
John
Some input from me.
My Outsider would be much of a muchness in weight with your Whaler I would guess. When I had my new trailer built I opted for the Torsion suspension with axles which were rated to 2.5T I think in order to get the trailer registered at 3.5T - all Aussie parts and I have been very pleased with the stability and ride quietness of this suspension set up. Yes they don't load share but this has not been a problem for me (so far !).
I have a couple of mates that have torsion suspension and still going strong after 10 years
cheers
marble
Posts: 773
Date Joined: 03/09/09
Torsion suspension under a
Torsion suspension under a pmy 24 for 7 years. BMT just on 2900 kg when i towed in to exmouth 6 years ago so very close to 3500 when full of fuel, water, ice, gear etc etc. It seems to be quieter and smoother than leaf trailers, definitely quieter. It never goes off raid apart from Tanta's ramp so load sharing not an issue for us.
PMY 25 Centre Console DF300 Suzuki
Rob H
Posts: 5744
Date Joined: 18/01/12
The load sharing is as much
The load sharing is as much when you back up a curb etc.
But the issue for John and everyone else is that the ADR's dictate 120% capacity.
Unfortunately while Iwas looking at trailers imported and sold here by companies, they just fudged the numbers to get them over the pits as a manufacturer only needs something like 1 in 20 to be inspected.
Bottom line, if a yank trailer has Ford 5 stud pattern and torsions it almost certainly wouldnt have passed if built here and inspected as the 3500# axles they fit wont make 7000lb here in WA in a pair (3200kg).
Give a man a mask, and he'll show you his true face...
The older you get the more you realize that no one has a f++king clue what they're doing.
Everyone's just winging it.
Ian S
Posts: 71
Date Joined: 20/01/14
Single leaf springs
The last two trailers I have owned had single leaf springs, they lasted and have worked very well.
JohnF
Posts: 2836
Date Joined: 07/07/10
Great replies. Looking like
Great replies.
Looking like 2.5 t torsion axles as per Cruise Control which will allow full 3.5 t, but will need new everything (rims, brakes)! Rob H has hit the nail on the head on de-rating.......
Ah well, its only money!
Boston Whaler 235 Conquest......getting the flogging it was built for.
roddo
Posts: 482
Date Joined: 16/10/09
I got my magit tilt changed
I got my magit tilt changed over to all aussie gear about 10 months ago i went with leafs i think total cost was just over 5k drive away they had it for a day without the boat on it i couldnt be bothered doing it all. That was still using my current rims and tyres as they were a 6 stud
Belly Fish
Posts: 499
Date Joined: 09/03/12
Torsion for me
Hey John, mine has 2.5 t torsion axles and bigger hubs and bearings. Boat/motor/trailer weighed in at 3357kg, so similar to yours. Tows like a dream...and no rusty springs. You won't regret it.
Belly
JohnF
Posts: 2836
Date Joined: 07/07/10
Cheers Belly.
Cheers Belly.
Boston Whaler 235 Conquest......getting the flogging it was built for.
ranmar850
Posts: 2702
Date Joined: 12/08/12
Don't use single leaf springs!
Due to a lack of wrap, when a single leaf breaks through the locating pin hole, you instantly lose your axle location, meaning the wheel is forced backwards, bending your axle and most likely destroying your guard, and the the tyre itself as it tries to go under your rear bracket. I've had it happen to me on a tandem (non-load sharing) single leaf spring boat trailer, and seen it happen on a single axle as well. You have to replace everything on that axle assembly to fix it. At least with multi-leaves you have a chance of picking up on broken leaves before it goes terminal and leaves you stranding, or, worse, in a major accident.
As for torsion bars, maybe OK on bitumen, but they just fail miserably, from what I've seen, when you go on the dirt. They put them on the flash "off-road" campers and caravans, and when they fail, which they do, you end up back with good old reliable rocker/roller load sharing tandem multileaves.
As for actual rating, don't the non-load sharing axles end up with a trailer rating of only one set of springs, ie, dual single leaf 1500kg pairs will only give you a rating of 1500kg, instad of 300kg? I've read the ADR's around trailer construction when I built my own, and that was my understanding of it. So your twin 2.5 t torsions would still only give you a rating of 2.5 t, or am I remembering it wrong?
Rob H
Posts: 5744
Date Joined: 18/01/12
No, 2 sets of any load
No, 2 sets of any load sharing system will give you the sum.
2 x 1500kg will give 3000kg
2 x 1500kg non load sharing will give 3000kg ~120% =2500kg
Not many people including inspectors seem to have cottoned on that dual slipper springs are not load sharing as normally installed either.
Give a man a mask, and he'll show you his true face...
The older you get the more you realize that no one has a f++king clue what they're doing.
Everyone's just winging it.
Vinesh87
Posts: 2751
Date Joined: 02/04/11
I have load sharing springs
I have load sharing springs on my trailer rated to 3500kgs. 5 years old now and still very good condition. No dramas!
Torsion seems to tow better and lower to the grohnd but i always throught if one broke your stuffed nothing repairable? At least with springs someone around town might be able to help?
ranmar850
Posts: 2702
Date Joined: 12/08/12
Repairability is an advantage with springs
With anything other than springs,fine if you don't mind waiting for an expensive tow, then perhaps spending days you haven't allowed for waiting for the parts to be freighted from Perth.
I say this from experience--had the aforementioned episode with the single leaf dual axle setup failure on the Ningaloo Homestead road. Removed the badly bent axle,and torn-up tyre, drove into Exmouth, bought a new axle, tyre and pair of springs ( pair, because after the amount of stress imparted to bend a 40mm axle, the spring it has pivoted on must be suspect), drov back out and fitted it. Wouldn't care to repeat the xperience, but we were going under our own steam instead of having to wait it out in Exmouth for several days, and pay for a tilt-bed to bring the boat and trailer in. I always have spare shackles, bearings, etc, and you only need to add just one set of springs to be bulletproof.
That same trip, a camper trailer lay by the track for 2 weeks, flash "off-road" trailing axle setup torn out from under it on one side.