Lost crab pots - what do you do?
Went out for a crab yesterday in Peel. Set our 10 and caught heaps off U/S again. All getting closer but only ended up with one keeper. I forgot the ice so it was just kept in the live tank, and was returned to grow some more.
But we came across 3 lonely floats sitting in the middle off nowhere. It was obvious these pots have been "lost" as they were not linked to a string, and there were no boats around. We kept watching but at the end decided to remove them because all they were was a hazard.
Now when we hauled home we had 13 nets onboard, albeit the 3 rescued pots had no baitholders left (but one had a tangled crab in it which we freed).
I was not sure whether we did the right or wrong thing from fisheries point off view. GoPro-ed the discussion about lifting them just incase fisheries came along as we believed it was the correct thing to do to remove the hazards.
2 off the nets are in a crapy state, the other is a brand spanking new large pot.
Question: what is the correct thing to do, did we do wrong. And would we be breaking the law if fisheries came along?
Cheers
Neels
"I would like to die on Mars. Just not on impact!!" _ Elon Musk
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Walfootrot
Posts: 1385
Date Joined: 23/07/12
IMO, you should phone
IMO, you should phone fisheries and follow their advice or direction.
You have broken the law by pulling 13 pots, you have taken the law into your own hands. you should be stoned to deat..... thats going a bit far... sorry.
just phone them next time to cover your ass, no point doing the "right thing" to end up busted for it.
More drum lines, kill the bloody sharks!
crasny1
Posts: 7002
Date Joined: 16/10/08
(No subject)
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dumper
Posts: 1027
Date Joined: 03/04/08
What would have happened if
What would have happened if it had been a pro pot
crasny1
Posts: 7002
Date Joined: 16/10/08
Pros dont use pots
They have crab traps. And the Pros in Peel pulls theirs and dont leave them in over the weekends.
We live in Bouvard(Parkridge) and can see them clearly from our balcony. Poor buggers must get up about 3am, out on the water after that and back in by 7am every morning. We can see 3 boats working the stretch infront off the house.
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D_d_001
Posts: 1522
Date Joined: 09/03/13
yeah exactly at Walfotrot
yeah exactly at Walfotrot says easy phone call.
FWIW you did the next best thing. Fisheries are generally OK, don't think they are out there to be too pedantic ...not as if you came home with 13 pots and 156 undersize crabs!
in the end they know the difference between ppl trying to do the right thing and the blatant idiots.
shortfuse
Posts: 211
Date Joined: 02/01/12
Touching other peoples gear
Touching other peoples gear is totally out of order, even if you think its unattended.
I know alot of people who will spread gear out particularly when its hard to find a feed, you were lucky that there wasn't someone watching or it probably would have been on in a big way.
Fisheries still could of fined you for carrying excess pots for your "good deed", pretty hard to justify them as a hazard with all the different types of pots out on the water
crasny1
Posts: 7002
Date Joined: 16/10/08
Yes it was a debate about what to do
Clearly there was no other boats around. All 3 pots was well apart from each other with different floats. And 2 was very clearly very old.
I do see and believe that a single pot can be a hazard, because we tend to look for strings. It was pretty nice when we went out but then blew up and covered in whitecaps. Was pretty hard to see them and a jetski almost hit one which is what prompted the discussion about what to do.
Wouldnt even think about touching someones pots. There was another boat about 400m away and inbetween strings motored over to ask them if they had lost a pot as we have found 3 stragglers.
I am sure that pots are lost, and then if nobody did anything the place would be littered.
Im not saying what I did was 100% correct because I was concerned about this. Just trying to get a clearer picture on what is the correct thing to do. I wasnt going to just leave them there to rot.
PS: also came across a floatless line that we couldnt grab because it was so windy.
"I would like to die on Mars. Just not on impact!!" _ Elon Musk
dumper
Posts: 1027
Date Joined: 03/04/08
Fisheries wouldn't care
Fisheries wouldn't care about having 3 extra nets in the boat. They'd have to prove that you were fishing with 13. I used to always carry 1 spare net just in case 1 went missing or got busted up
crasny1
Posts: 7002
Date Joined: 16/10/08
Likewise
I do have a spare. But it is totally wrapped, no float nor cage. And is stored up in the cabin and obviously very dry. But I had 13 "wet" ones which was the concern. If I was a fisheries officer and came across a boat with 13 wet pots I would bust his ass. Hence the GoPro footage about the discussion, and showing the pots. As mentioned 2 were very obviously there for ages. Covered in slime and weed. The other one was very shallow on the eastern shore and was the one the jetskier almost cleaned up. As mentioned all three had no bait holding possibility, and my spare cages have been used because off probable stingrays removing 2!!!(I use those black clip on cages)
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shortfuse
Posts: 211
Date Joined: 02/01/12
Oh really I would like to see
Oh really I would like to see you test that one, the rule clearly states that its a maximum of 10 pots per boat regardless of how many persons on board, no mention of keeping spares just in case. So I don't think they would have to prove anything other than you were in excess of 10 pots
hezzy
Posts: 1521
Date Joined: 27/11/09
oh really ?? people need to
oh really ??
people need to stop and grab some common sense lol , what a heinous crime , pc brigade are rampant
crasny , i would not sweat it mate, if someone leaves a few nets out there and there unattended over the course of the arvo removing them is quite ok , if you have tried to seek out any possible owners etc
there only going to be a navigation hazard, and add unwanted polution to the waterway ,etc etc
i always carry a spare net in the boat,in case we do one in , with two people crabbing , it would be the hezbolah , nazi of fisheries officer only that might want to try and charge you , & even then it would be hard pressed ime , to find a judge who would convict you of it ,
the wording in the media pamphlet on rules is going to be different from the actual act id guess ,
fisheries are pretty savvy on who is doing the right thing & who isnt , if you had of been stopped , tell em what happened , dont think you would have a problem at all
recfishwest have been in the media latly , asking fishers to remove unwanted fishing gear from our water ways and dispose of it properly ,
hezzy
OFW 11
evil flourishes when good men do nothing
Buz
Posts: 1555
Date Joined: 28/08/07
+1 :-) Alot of opinionated
+1 :-)
Alot of opinionated Fisheries law experts posting on here lately. In the absence of getting a defined written answer from fisheries, common sense will have to prevail. If a person chooses to interpret a info pamphlet in their way, good for them. I'll interpret it to my best my way and follow it until told otherwise by a written clarification from fisheries.
Fisheries never questioned the fact I had 10 pots set and 2 unrigged spares on my boat off Busso two years ago. And they did see them.
crasny1
Posts: 7002
Date Joined: 16/10/08
Cheers Hezzy
I certainly didnt think pulling them was wrong, because they were obviously not attended, werent pro and 2 was as old as the hills. The other newer one was only because it was difficult to see and the jetski(s) was in the area and one came acropper after trying to avoid it. Could see he was pissed off at the pot, so decided to remove that aswell. As mentioned no bait but had a tangled crab in it, U/S and freed.
However at the same point also knew it wasnt right to do it legally. So wanted to clarify the situation and raise this as a question because I have lost nets, others have, and someone has to remove these or else there would be single old pots everywhere, and it is a hazard.
Turns out that one off the old floats looked very familiar and I wondered if it might have belonged to my neighbour, who uses the same layout with pot/rope/float. Just got a text from the Mrs saying its his pot that he lost 2 weeks ago. So one owner found and he is getting me a six pack -- score.
"I would like to die on Mars. Just not on impact!!" _ Elon Musk
shortfuse
Posts: 211
Date Joined: 02/01/12
common sense does not always
common sense does not always have alot to do with it nor how "Henoius" a crime you see it being. As someone pointed out last week just by touching their phone it brought about a fine just the same as if he used the phone. Pointing out the rules as they are printed not all fisheries guys are so easy to deal with as are some coppers
hezzy
Posts: 1521
Date Joined: 27/11/09
short fuse , your drawing
short fuse ,
your drawing along bow mate comparing illegal phone usage to carrying more than ten crab nets in your boat , as i posted common sense , where has it gone ??
mucking around with your phone in the car , can and does regularly contribute to people having car accidents and even dying , while we may not agree with it , it is understandable why the coppers come down hard, with a take no excuses mentality about it , especially when it was recently changed and advertised in the media ,
carrying an extra crab net or 3 in your boat ?? yep its a dam criminal act, , only thing to die might be a blowie or chicken wing , neck chop , or if i get lucky a bloody crab ,
if you read the fisheries act , id be pretty sure the actual wording says you cannot use, or it is illegal , or you may legally use no more than ten nets from a boat at any one time , and absolutly feck all is intended or stipulated about how many you can carry in your boat ,
the problem lies in how these regs are interpreted and re written for printing to make then user friendlier so we can all understand them easier in the media [not ]
id be stunned if anyone has ever been booked for carrying extra nets , & i for one would be very happy to go to court and challenge it if a charge was ever to be laid ,
the intent of the law was to only allow 10 crab nets to be used by persons fishing from a boat at any one time , that is actively baited and set in the water ie = used & to enjoy the experience and catch a feed within sustainable limits
not have a brain hameorage stressing over hypotheticals of pc correctness interpreting the law
most people have had some experience when nets have been left or lost , and you generally know if another boat is working them near you ,
you just make the decision to leave em alone for the owner to come back and find or remove them
it aint that hard ,
how many times have people left/lost nets when crabbing ?it happens ,
how many times did you go back & expect to find them still there ??
not very often id guess
think about it , its not that hard really imho ,
hezzy
OFW 11
evil flourishes when good men do nothing
crasny1
Posts: 7002
Date Joined: 16/10/08
Cheers hezzy
I do think that you sum it up well.
I certainly did not want to break a law. But also didnt want to leave obvious misplaced pots behind to mess up the area, or potentiallu foul a motor etc.
We were out for some time and noticed the 2 close to the start and end off the string. The other was noted when the jetskier came across it.
Im not feeling guilty for pulling them as there was no malice intended, nor would I view criticism off this as a concern. I was trying to clarify how you would go about it within the laws because due care have been taken to ensure they didnt belong there at that time, was obviously misplaced and unattended and old.
Might call my Fisheries mate and get his perspective. I couldnt get hold of him yesterday or today.
Cheers
Neels
"I would like to die on Mars. Just not on impact!!" _ Elon Musk
RobertMc
Posts: 326
Date Joined: 19/01/09
I think the pros use proper
I think the pros use proper cage style nets and they leave them out over night. I know in the past I have set my nets in dawseville and driven to Mandurah and back after a little while to give them a bit more time to soak. So I think if I was on that position I wouldn't of touched them just incase someone was leaving them a bit longer, maybe call fisheries give them the coords and let them deal with it...
crasny1
Posts: 7002
Date Joined: 16/10/08
I agree this could happen
But then you would see other pots in a "string"
These were not part off a string, had different floats and all three were well apart. We have a long "string" to try and figure out if they the crabs are deep or shallow this time off the year. Once a pattern emerge our strings are way shorter. Yesterday probably 100m apart making a 500m string.
"I would like to die on Mars. Just not on impact!!" _ Elon Musk
chris raff
Posts: 3257
Date Joined: 09/02/10
Lots of blokes do it in
Lots of blokes do it in relation to cray pots as well lol .. only drama I foresee is if a big hairy bloke named Bruce motors up and reckons they're his as your pulling them up .
“Intelligence is like a four-wheel drive. It only allows you to get stuck in more remote places.”
petermac
Posts: 2946
Date Joined: 03/03/10
i have always wondered why
I have always why you couldn't use 20 drop nets if you wanted to , if you didn't take more crabs than your allowed
Buz
Posts: 1555
Date Joined: 28/08/07
Maybe if your in a small
Maybe if your in a small area, or there are heaps of boats it means there is room for people to have a clear line to put out their nets?
I mean eg if there are 20 boats it means 200 nets. If you were allowed 20 nets per boat there would be 400 nets out taking up a huge area I guess.
Guess its a bit like say on a beach/rockwall/jetty if someone had more than their two lines/rods out it would start to take up alot of space, and not allow others to fish.
crasny1
Posts: 7002
Date Joined: 16/10/08
I agree
From our home we have uninterupted views off the estuary. Last year counted 43 boats we could see crabbing on a day I was bored. That is 430 Pots!!!!
If you could use as many as you like Wow. You would be able to walk across using the floats as stepping stones.
"I would like to die on Mars. Just not on impact!!" _ Elon Musk
crasny1
Posts: 7002
Date Joined: 16/10/08
Straight from the horses mouth
Spoke to fisheries.
What I did was and is an offense!!! However not punishable now
It IS an offense to have more than 10 pots onboard. You are not allowed to have a "spare(s)"
The correct proceedure is to gps coordinate them and then report to fisheries.
If it is an obvious old pot and you dont have 10 onboard you can retrieve it as rubbish but you better have proof its old like covered in weed etc.
Certainly thought I was doing the right thing, but proved not to be legal if I was stopped.
"I would like to die on Mars. Just not on impact!!" _ Elon Musk
Buz
Posts: 1555
Date Joined: 28/08/07
And there we go. Cheers for
And there we go. Cheers for finding out Crasny and letting us know. Now confirmed and not just hearsay or an opinion. Guess my spares will have to stay my ute back at the beach :-)
Sulo
Posts: 256
Date Joined: 13/08/11
A charter operator got done
A charter operator got done not so long ago. He had a couple of smaller boats that operated from the mother ship so had enough nets for the smaller tenders. Fisheries busted him with more than ten nets as they were all stored on the main vessel at the time.
Gotta remeber the letter of the law when laws are written by lawyers! The intent of the law is long forgotten in a lot of situations unfortunately and means nothing if you get the wrong person doing the checking.
shortfuse
Posts: 211
Date Joined: 02/01/12
well done cransy to follow up
well done cransy to follow up and set the record straight, full points
hezzy
Posts: 1521
Date Joined: 27/11/09
crasny , it would appear we
crasny , it would appear we both have been breaking the law , myself for years according to the act below ,as i mostly always carry a spare net onboard & have never had a problem when checked by fisheries
so i stand corrected ,they do mean you cant carry more than 10 all common sense is lost ,
id love the oppurtunity to take it to court & put it before a judge though
http://www.slp.wa.gov.au/pco/prod/FileStore.nsf/Documents/MRDocument:25466P/$FILE/Fish%20Resources%20Management%20Regulations%201995%20-%20[12-f0-00].pdf?OpenElement
Fish Resources Management Regulations 1995
Requirements regarding fishing gear Part 4A
Statewide requirements regarding fishing gear Division 2
r. 64L
As at 20 Nov 2013 Version 12-f0-00 page 79
Extract from www.slp.wa.gov.au, see that website for further information
64L. Crabs, permitted ways to fish for by recreational fishers
(1) A person, other than the holder of a commercial fishing licence,
must not fish for crabs other than —
(a) by hand; or
(b) by using not more than 10 complying drop nets; or
(c) by using a hand scoop net that complies with
subregulation (3); or
(d) by using a wire hook which is not capable of piercing a
crab and is held in the hand.
(2) The master of a boat which is not a licensed fishing boat must
not use, cause or permit to be carried on the boat, more than
10 drop nets in any one day.
(3A) The master of a boat which is not a licensed fishing boat must
not use, or cause or permit to be carried on the boat, a drop net
that is not a complying drop net.
(3) A hand scoop net must —
(a) be generally hemispherical; and
(b) be hollow; and
(c) have a circular top rim with an internal diameter not
exceeding 375
OFW 11
evil flourishes when good men do nothing
crasny1
Posts: 7002
Date Joined: 16/10/08
Yes mate
I think that somehow we all Do inadvertently "break" the law without meaning to, but then ignorance is not bliss.
There is a lot off small print.
I wonder about carrying "spare" rods onboard as I often go fishing looking like an overgrown porcupine.
BUT you are only allowed 2 per person. So if 2 are fishing as on our boat 4 rods, BUT I have about another 8 in the holders??? Are these spares. Im not using them, Im carrying them.
So what is then wrong with a SPARE net. If I was busted I would like to see what a judge thinks??
"I would like to die on Mars. Just not on impact!!" _ Elon Musk
Rob H
Posts: 5794
Date Joined: 18/01/12
Ditto craypots, if i recall
Ditto craypots, if i recall right we would always carry a spare on deck with no problem and pot numbers were very strictly enforced commercially.
Give a man a mask, and he'll show you his true face...
The older you get the more you realize that no one has a f++king clue what they're doing.
Everyone's just winging it.
Auslobster
Posts: 1901
Date Joined: 03/05/08
How long ago...
...was this, Rob? When I was a deckie ten years ago, the rules quite clearly stated that we couldn't carry any spares...if we lost a pot, we'd have to go to the shed and get another one...
shonky
Posts: 203
Date Joined: 22/04/12
2 rods
Shit, I didn't know that. I usually carry 3 per person. 1 for dragging a lure around, 1 for bottom bouncing and a small rig for catching live bait, squid etc, but only use one at a time.
This habit is getting expensive!
Buz
Posts: 1555
Date Joined: 28/08/07
Two rod/lines per person was
Two rod/lines per person was only for landbased if I remember correctly. From a boat you can use as many rod/lines as you want. Might have changed?
pale ale
Posts: 1755
Date Joined: 02/01/10
Typical winters day in the
Typical winters day in the Pilbara:
4 game rods for trolling marlin lures
1 game rod rigged with a livie for pitching at billfish in the spread
2 bottom bashing rods to catch some reds
1 rod with a livebait jig for catching bait
1 casting rod for throwing lures at tuna schools
2 light rods to catch a few squid on the way home
so we have 11 rods for 2 people on board...... hope that is not an offence!!
Lastchance
Posts: 1273
Date Joined: 02/02/09
Not to mention line class
Not to mention line class comps......
Nev76
Posts: 3
Date Joined: 07/12/13
Wat would u know last chance
Wat would u know last chance u muppet
meglodon
Posts: 5981
Date Joined: 17/06/10
Thanks to Hezzy and Crazny1
Thanks for the follow up and putting the record straight guys now we all know how the law stands
NOHA
Posts: 914
Date Joined: 24/06/07
good to know
I have always carried 15 or more crab nets on board. extra ones with long ropes. I would set a string starting shallow with shorter ropes out to deeper water. If the crabs where deep then I would take out the short pots and work the deep.
I thought it was not fishing with more than 10 pots in the water.
These rules are getting beyond a joke. So friggin complex that honest people are making mistakes
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