Mercury Twin 125 Optimax Vs. Twin 115 four stroke Vs. 225 Verado.
Submitted by t bone on Sat, 2014-05-24 12:42
Gday all..
Looking at a few different options at the moment, and wondering what advice people would have on the whole 2 motors Vs. 1 motor - mixed up with "everyday" 2 stroke Vs. 4 results.
Vinesh87
Posts: 2751
Date Joined: 02/04/11
2 optis very expensive to
2 optis very expensive to run, 2 4st slightly better than 2 optis. Big single cheaper and lighter with less service costs. Having said that I have never been a fan of mercury. Personally I would be going a single 225 suzuki. Only advantage of twins is redundancy and docking.
Rob H
Posts: 5801
Date Joined: 18/01/12
Yeah Vin is right.I have
Yeah Vin is right.
I have twin DF115's they were on my boat when I got it.
They are great engines and the trips I use the boat for-almost exclusively Abrolhos with a load of kids the backup is a huge weight off the mind.
For manoevering there really isnt that much advantage as they are very close together.
Advantages-redundancy, trolling, redundancy, some manoevering, trimming athwartship, redundancy, peace of mind
Disadvantages-cost to buy run and service (I service my own), weight
If you operate out of metro or close to a regional centre-go a single Yam or Suz 250.
Often we are lucky to see a couple of boats for the whole trip where in metro there is boat and rescue everywhere.
Personally if I was setting up itd be a large single and a small 15 to get back to an anchorage at the Islands-ANY engine no matter what can fail at any time
Give a man a mask, and he'll show you his true face...
The older you get the more you realize that no one has a f++king clue what they're doing.
Everyone's just winging it.
Cruise Control
Posts: 973
Date Joined: 03/11/10
I have a 23' boat with twin
I have a 23' boat with twin 115 Yamaha 4 strokes. Main benefit is backup and ability to trim. With motors today, if I was buying new, would be a big single and fit trims tabs. I looked at Mercury Optis but the servicing cost is a bit expensive being even more than 4 strokes.
cheers
t bone
Posts: 351
Date Joined: 20/04/14
Vin, i'm with you on not
Vin, i'm with you on not being a huge fan on the mercury motors, but the dealer that im looking at getting the new boat (6.7 surtees gamefisher) from only deal with Merc's. Im wondering if its worth the pain of buying everything but the motors and sourcing them elsewhere.
The biggest thing im shooting for is redundacy and the trimming. Ive got trim tabs on my quinny at the moment and they drive me crazy sometimes (good chance im trying to use them wrong thou) so the idea of motor trimming is a bonus too.
Rob--- Its a good point that you make regarding the VMR anyhow. its a huge piece of mind having the Batavia number at home. The dealer is getting back to me with a breakdown of getting the boat with either a twin or single transom, so it should be interesting on the cost difference there.
dodgy
Posts: 4578
Date Joined: 01/02/10
Worth the pain of sorting
Worth the pain of sorting elsewhere. As a Vmr skipper I've towed home more mercs than anything else.
Does anyone know where the love of god goes, when the waves turn the minutes to hours?
ace rimmer
Posts: 187
Date Joined: 19/08/13
made in Japan
there's only 3 words to consider if you are buying an outboard and that is Made In Japan, eg Suzuki, Yamaha, Honda. I would stay away from Merc and Etec. Also the opti's and Etecs are worth nothing second hand because they are a 2 stroke. The opti's are a lot noiser than a 4 stroke as well
t bone
Posts: 351
Date Joined: 20/04/14
VMR coverage.
Dodgy.
I work away with a 28/28 (days) rotation. But when im home i would love to offer some assistiance back to the VMR. How did you get into it? Im based in Geraldton, but travel upto Kalbarri a reasonable amount (grew up there) as the folks are there still. Its an interesting fact about mercs being one of you more popular reason's of rescue.
Ive got a 200 opti on my 6.5 at the moment and would like the idea of making the move to the 4's. I was trying to decide between a Honda & Yammy, but when this dealer mentioned that they only deal with Merc's. I was thiking about just accepting the fact. But the more i hear, the more i think i might get a "supply & fit" package elsewhere.
carnarvonite
Posts: 8669
Date Joined: 24/07/07
VMR
Front up at the door or give Gero VMR a ring, most groups away from the metro area are usually short on vollies either as radio ops or boat crews. They will provide what training is necessary.
With your dealer, he can get the engine you want if he really has to, his profit margins will be smaller, if he can't I'd suggest going elsewhere.
Or get the boat without an engine and get another dealer to fit one of your choosing.
Paul H
Posts: 2104
Date Joined: 18/01/07
Definitely go with a 4
Definitely go with a 4 stroke, quiet, less fumes and better economy.
As above I personally would go with the yammy or suzi's.
Rightly or wrongly Mercs have a stigma about them (probably from days gone past) and resale is not as good should you sell etc. later.
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Stevo81
Posts: 1278
Date Joined: 16/04/12
I agree, stay away from
I agree, stay away from mercury. My marine mechanic reckons he has by far the most dramas with them than anything else, especially verados. Honda, Suzuki, Yamaha all much of a muchness
•••••••• Electrical Contractor NOR ••••••••
t bone
Posts: 351
Date Joined: 20/04/14
VMR.
Im set on getting the SURTEES, and have had a look around for other dealers on the west coast. But seems there is the only one. There was a thought about bringing in from the other side of the island, but id imagine the cost to transport would outweigh any benefit. I might drop into there when home and jsut let them know anyhow. I work in the offshore indrusty, so i have a lot of that kind of training and certs anyhow.
I think the mind is made up on the Yammy.. either a set of twin 115's. Or going with one of the big 250's. Just which one :-/ first world problems i guess :)
Paul H
Posts: 2104
Date Joined: 18/01/07
? On the surtees if you went
? On the surtees if you went twins would you have separate fuel and leccy systems as well. Assuming you only have one underfloor tank it might make the twins v single motor less of a safety factor as if your fuel is contaminated it takes out both motors anyhow. still is some benefit though but something to consider.
other thing to consider is new motors nowadays are pretty good as far as reliability goes.
What about just getting the hull/trailer and then taking it elsewhere to get motor fitted (even though your not buying the complete package would surely be less expensive than freighting from interstate).
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Rob H
Posts: 5801
Date Joined: 18/01/12
T bone, the merc dealer in
T bone, the merc dealer in town wouldnt be my first choice to deal with.
The seperate fuel tanks issue is a valid one however if you put contaminated fuel in your boat you probably wouldnt make it far outside the harbour anyhow?
Still if fishing out around the Abrolhos alone (as we do) no matter how reliable I'd have a backup-even a 10hp will get you back to an anchorage/jetty where you can "borrow" some rainwater and sit it out til a tow comes along.
Otherwise even 50meters from land with a light breeze you wont paddle a 2.5 tonne boat far!
As a seafarer/engineer I have seen catastrophic failures on 2 Caterpillars, a GM and an MTU before their first 20 hours, thats not a shutdown or alarm but complete failure, mostly a conrod or piston.
Give a man a mask, and he'll show you his true face...
The older you get the more you realize that no one has a f++king clue what they're doing.
Everyone's just winging it.
t bone
Posts: 351
Date Joined: 20/04/14
Fuel systems.
Gday Paul.
Being an offshore sparky myself im going to have an electrical system on there 2nd to none :)
I agree with you on the split fuel systems for sure. As far as i know the 6.7 gamefisher comes with a 280 ltr tank. im going to try and request that when getting built, they simply split it in half so i can have seperate fuel systems. If unable to, at a minium i would be running 2 seperators with ya clear sight glass. Not going to be bullet proof, but helps out a bit i hope.
As for the reliability, i would agree with you, if it wernt for my optimax siezing the lower leg due to "incorrect tolerance" on the prop shaft, 11 hrs from brand new.
Rob H
Posts: 5801
Date Joined: 18/01/12
are you back at work Tbone?
are you back at work Tbone?
Give a man a mask, and he'll show you his true face...
The older you get the more you realize that no one has a f++king clue what they're doing.
Everyone's just winging it.
t bone
Posts: 351
Date Joined: 20/04/14
Back in the south china sea for a month
Yeah Rob.
Started my tour again on thursday just gone. The break that just passed, i got home friday lunchtime (25th Apr). So that gave me enough time to get some things together and head to the islands as part of a 3 boat convoy the next morning. Which resulted me in towing a 28ft Berty back from about the half way mark, then another lad from out in the channel and a fella in the marina with a yacht that had something go wrong. Then-to top of it off. got home and discovered the missus in a rather sour mood.. Apparently it was her birthday that saturday too... Great way to start the month at home..
I know what your talking about regarding the merc dealer. i would love to make the move over to the Yamaha clan, but just discovered they are the agent for them too.
We are running 7 x EMD 710's (V20 by stewet & steverson) and we had a rather large boo boo back in the very begining also. At the end of the day, they are all machines i guess.
Rob H
Posts: 5801
Date Joined: 18/01/12
pm sentAndrew who used to
pm sent
Andrew who used to have Batavia outboards (Suzuki) is still in town and may be able to help, otherwise its Bayside (Honda/Etec) depending on preference
Give a man a mask, and he'll show you his true face...
The older you get the more you realize that no one has a f++king clue what they're doing.
Everyone's just winging it.
JohnF
Posts: 2836
Date Joined: 07/07/10
I must admit i was not keen
I must admit i was not keen at all about mercs and Verados in particular, my last choice, but the boat I wanted had one.
I have now done 240 hrs on it (Verado 250) and it has been great. Heaps of grunt compared with naturally aspirated 4's but a tad heavier on juice when you push it over 25 knots.
Services are highway robbery - as with most outboards, so I do it all myself, very easy and the yanks give you all the details and you Do NOT void your mercury warranty by servicing yourself.
My old man has had Yammy 250's, good motors but he had Several issues......anything in salt water can be a problem.
I would not rate mercs as better than the jap motors, which are all very good, but would certainly get another one if it was on the right boat.
Boston Whaler 235 Conquest......getting the flogging it was built for.
Paul H
Posts: 2104
Date Joined: 18/01/07
Haven't had a merc myself
Haven't had a merc myself John but would assume their current and late model motors are fine. That being said they do carry a bit of stigma (probably unwarranted for current models) particularly back from the days of the blue and red band motors.
As far as mercs accounting for a majority of tows and mech issues it could be this is due to older model mercs still being in the mix.
Your first sentence said it all as far as resale
- two identical boats, both for the same price.
- one with a late model merc the other with a late model yammy or suzi
- which would you buy??
- Would you be prepared to pay an extra grand to get the one with the yammy/suzi??
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Vinesh87
Posts: 2751
Date Joined: 02/04/11
Same I never wanted a Merc
Same
I never wanted a Merc but just put over 400hrs on my Mercruiser and it never skipped one beat. Was brilliant to be honest, services were not that bad i guess.
Any new motor that is well maintained should serv you well, but for resale you would always go the suz or yam over a merc. Unless you want that holeshot of the verado !