Commercial rule changes
Submitted by C.P on Sat, 2023-06-10 12:39
What are the changes to commercial fishing for demersals?
I've read about the new recreational rules and the tags for charter boats but not much about commercial fishing
Is the Government buying back licenses, or is commercail fishing for demersals banned around Perth / Mandurah?
I'm hoping that everyone is sharing the pain.
carnarvonite
Posts: 8627
Date Joined: 24/07/07
Pros
Pros have been banned from using demersal nets from just south of Preston beach right through to Lancelin for over 20 years, quite a bit of pain happened then with no recourse to them for the closure
XF347
Posts: 100
Date Joined: 02/06/17
Commercial fishable hours
Commercial fishable hours have been halved. Ie they pay for a number of days to be able to fish each year, if they have 10 days on the licence they are now only able to fish 5 of them.
C.P
Posts: 345
Date Joined: 04/01/12
Commercial fishable hours
Wow, they are sharing the pain. Are they being compensated for the reduction?
Jamie-Chester
Posts: 114
Date Joined: 28/07/10
Complicated
But in a nutshell.
pros have been allocated 64% of Demersal catch in a very very flawed ifm regime 12 years ago
pro ban between Mandurah and Lancelin out to 250metres depth for a long time. I believe they were compensated for this loss 15 years ago.
wetline effort managed by days fished but with no quota (its nominal). So they can still catch more than their quota if abundance is high and fishing good...as what happened some years ago with a high recruitment pulse of pink snapper which they quickly fished down the stock of.
days have been halved as has nominal quota but they were already only catching half their nominal quota more or less so no one knows how actual tonnage will be affected
and 2.5 million dollars has been allocated to buy catch from wet liners and will be gifted to Demersal gillnetters. Not sure if this is corruption, nepotism or stupidity - take your pick.
recs thrown under the bus compared to pros which is weird considering rec sector generates 100 times the economic activity from 36% of the catch
management in this fishery is reactive and simply stupid. I will be surprised if it is still open at all in five years given the current regime. Then tags quota etc will become irrelevant.
a 50/50 split of the resource was the best way forward but all props to Wafic for being able to hoodwink the minister into what’s been done.
Its very complicated - if you had a week I could explain it. Maybe
Rob H
Posts: 5745
Date Joined: 18/01/12
Mostly correct except there
Mostly correct except there are no "demersal gillnetters" that I know of.
The first 18.5 tonnes of quota bought back is to be given/sold/leased (they have not said and I have asked for clarification) to shark gilnetters to cover their "bycatch" shortfall with the reductions.
Other than that, I share your scepticism about this revelation...
Give a man a mask, and he'll show you his true face...
The older you get the more you realize that no one has a f++king clue what they're doing.
Everyone's just winging it.
Pete F
Posts: 310
Date Joined: 07/01/18
2 gill net boats in
2 gill net boats in Lancelin.
Cheers
marble
Posts: 773
Date Joined: 03/09/09
So propping up a wasteful,
So propping up a wasteful, indiscriminate fishery at the expense of everyone else in other words
PMY 25 Centre Console DF300 Suzuki
Rob H
Posts: 5745
Date Joined: 18/01/12
I certainly don't agree with
I certainly don't agree with this redistribution but to be clear the "gill net boats" referred to are shark boats AFAIK and DPIRD requires them to hold enough quota to cover the expected bycatch.
As far as I know there are no "demersal gilnet boats" in WA but happy to be corrected.
Note that I am certainly not defending this (in fact I think it has been done without any clarity) but it is also important people know this info accurately
Give a man a mask, and he'll show you his true face...
The older you get the more you realize that no one has a f++king clue what they're doing.
Everyone's just winging it.
Jamie-Chester
Posts: 114
Date Joined: 28/07/10
Glad you’re happy to be corrected Rob
It is literally bloody called the west coast Demersal gillnet and longline fishery.
The “bycatch” of scalefish makes up 20% approx by weight of their catch and that “bycatch” makes up probably 40% of the fishery’s value. So is it “bycatch” really?
Rob H
Posts: 5745
Date Joined: 18/01/12
I certainly am Jamie, however
I certainly am Jamie, however below is the explanation that came to me by DPIRD via the channels.
Despite the name, it isnt solely a demersal fishery.
And my purpose here is simply making sure people have accurate info, I do not agree with it at all.
"The gillnet sector catches approx 30t of demersal scalefish each year.
A 50% reduction would see that reduced by 15t.
The only way to do that (because it’s a method based fishery) would be to limit hours fished, which would reduce their take of shark."
I'm told the amount of shark quota that would be removed otherwise would be around 100T, this also would not be a good outcome nor would demersal "bycatch" being tossed overboard due to no quota.
Give a man a mask, and he'll show you his true face...
The older you get the more you realize that no one has a f++king clue what they're doing.
Everyone's just winging it.
Jamie-Chester
Posts: 114
Date Joined: 28/07/10
You literally said there are
You literally said there are no Demersal gillnet boats in wa. The fishery is literally called the Demersal gillnet fishery.
I’m not sure how you could be less correct. Anyway.
demersal of course refers to where this indiscriminate net is set. Yes it catches shark as well.
maybe shark is the bycatch and 80% of the fishery is bycatch? Is that a better way to frame it for you?
Anyway rob be careful of the shit Dpird feeds you. Just trust me on this as someone that has been involved in this a very very long time.
To get to the root of the issue the nets could be set in sand rather than flat coral like they do. This would result in less scalefish. But rather than make the gillnetters change like everyone else is expected to you have this nepotism.
we are expected to catch whiting and squid for six months but Demersal gillnetters are gifted quota so they don’t have to change their operation in any way?
Eff that bro.
Agree people need to know the facts.
carnarvonite
Posts: 8627
Date Joined: 24/07/07
Sand
If you set your nets on sand be prepaired to pull a good selection of handbags out when you check the net. Setting on sand allows whatever in the net to be cleaned out by sea lice overnight. Nothing worse than pulling what was once a good shark out and find it is only a skin with a bit of cartledge rattling around inside.
AND this is from someone who skippered a shark boat fishing down south
Jamie-Chester
Posts: 114
Date Joined: 28/07/10
Yep and that’s possibly a
Yep and that’s possibly a good point though Demersal gillnetters have also often claimed that they have the knowledge to avoid areas where scalefish are more likely to be caught. At the moment there is no incentive for them to do that though.
Jamie-Chester
Posts: 114
Date Joined: 28/07/10
Geez I just read your comment
Geez I just read your comment again. You have a profound misunderstanding of how this fishery is managed mate. They would never be forced to throw dead fish overboard due to having no quota as they have no bloody quota as it’s a days fished “estimated” quota managed fishery. You need to edit that comment as it’s completely false. I’m happy to stand corrected though.
Jamie-Chester
Posts: 114
Date Joined: 28/07/10
Actually here’s an olive
Actually here’s an olive branch. Why not just give me a ring or something if you want get a better understanding of things. It’s good you’re involved and I’m happy to help.
sea-kem
Posts: 14853
Date Joined: 30/11/09
I think you need a Snickers
I think you need a Snickers
Love the West!
Jamie-Chester
Posts: 114
Date Joined: 28/07/10
I need a snickers laced with
I need a snickers laced with Valium probably. That’s the problem with giving a shit...you actually give a shit. It’s an issue I’ve always had sadly.
Rob H
Posts: 5745
Date Joined: 18/01/12
Yes
Yes Jamie.
Me as well.
Its why I also "give a shit".
You are obviously well gifted with intellect above mine, but I'm unsure whether this has translated into achieving anymore than my minimal efforts.
You are preaching to the converted here, while I am merely passing on what has come to me.
I'm sure a phone conversation would probably clear the air, but presently I am at sea and prepping for a busy slipping of this vessel.
I don't feel that more negativity on how badly the WA Gov is shafting us will help me, this I already have in spades.
Just last week a lady friend very well known in our Midwest/Kalbarri charter and commercial fishing industries (and to me) took her life.
As well as my business partner from my commercial fishing days, plus a death in the family and plenty of other turmoil all while being involved in this demersal process.
I have no doubt at all that I will become jaded and probably bitter also, but have no desire to rush that process
Give a man a mask, and he'll show you his true face...
The older you get the more you realize that no one has a f++king clue what they're doing.
Everyone's just winging it.
Stoinka
Posts: 413
Date Joined: 02/09/06
Great reply Jamie, spot on,
Great reply Jamie, spot on, Gill netters are still operating down south.
C.P
Posts: 345
Date Joined: 04/01/12
Thanks
Well that's a pretty comprehensive answer, Thank You.
It was a sad day when i sold my boat earlier this year but a pretty easy desision to make.
Land based fishing only, for a while at least; maybe a re-think in a couple of years whether its worth buying another boat
hezzy
Posts: 1519
Date Joined: 27/11/09
good info on this being
good info on this being posted ,, jamie you and rob , should catch up ,, knowing you both personally , you both care deeply about this as do many others
i think you both would enjoy the meeting over a beer or whatever ,,
we have at least 3 gillnetters down south here and maybe more past augusta
hezzy
OFW 11
evil flourishes when good men do nothing
ChopChop
Posts: 67
Date Joined: 17/01/15
A different way perhaps
I came across an alternative system for managing charter fishing in Hawaii. Granted they target and catch mostly pelagics (YFT, Mahi Mahi, billfish) but it was interesting. The punters share enough of the catch for a few meals each and the charter operators can donate catch to charities or sell to local businesses. It must stay local and the aim is not to freeze. Not something I have ever come across, but interesting. Keeps local businesses operating, keeps seafood local and gives punters the opportunity to catch loads of fish. Obviously tailored to their fishery, but interesting approach. Jamie pointed out the return on catch by recs, and would assume charters also provide a good return compared to commercial operations, in high density environments such as Exmouth, Kalbarri etc.
davewillo
Posts: 2254
Date Joined: 08/09/16
I fished on a charter in
I fished on a charter in Hawaii years ago and the crew got to keep the catch unless a punter really wanted a feed. Most were tourists with no way to cook their catch anyway. It certainly makes for a very sharp, keen crew! We caught yellowfin, some huge mahi mahi and I got a short-billed spearfish. The punters and crew all went away very happy.
PGFC member and lure tragic
ChopChop
Posts: 67
Date Joined: 17/01/15
It certainly works there.
Its an approach I hadn't considered before. It puts it clearly in the commercial sphere if selling some catch so would displace some existing activity. I like the idea for it keeping the catch fresh and local, supporting small businesses and getting max return from the fishery. The charters might get cheaper if they can supplement with some back of boat sales too.
ChopChop
Posts: 67
Date Joined: 17/01/15
Double
Double up
timboon
Posts: 2924
Date Joined: 14/11/10
IMO they should just fuck
IMO they should just fuck the net boats off, I've got mates that long line for shark in SA and they are killing it, virtually no bi catch....
Cheers for your info Jamie and Rob, occasionally terminology gets lost in translation on text but I get what you are both saying here...