greenies on sea cruise
Submitted by uncle on Mon, 2012-01-09 08:57
Mummmm, did they get more then they bargained for? feed them whale burgers!!
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all aggressive fish love bigjohnsjigs
UncutTriggerInWA
Posts: 2692
Date Joined: 05/09/08
Walk the Plank
In years gone by they would be walking the plank. This is piracy and nothing more. Did they seriously think they could deliver a message and then hop back off the boat? These guys give me the shits and IMO are an embarrasment to the Australian people. I hope we don't use any tax payers money to deal with this situation. Let the Japs handle it. It's their problem.
Vince.
Work smart and fish often.
Member and die-hard supporter of the mighty West Coast Eagles.
smash
Posts: 434
Date Joined: 01/12/10
of course they didnt
the idea was I believe to force the whaler to return and unload the greenies and hence lose them from tailing them.
big john
Posts: 8783
Date Joined: 20/07/06
PMSL
Greenies on sea cruise! That's comedy gold right there.
WA based manufacturer and supplier of premium leadhead jigs, fligs, bucktail jigs, 'bulletproof' soft plastic jig heads and XOS bullet jig heads.
Jigs available online in my web store!
till
Posts: 9358
Date Joined: 21/02/08
I totally disagree. Good on
I totally disagree.
Good on em for trying to force the govt to intervene. I reckon if you did a straw poll on any corner in Aus, you wouldn't find the balance of people condone Jap whaling in Aus Antarctic waters, just the govt is too scared to intervene.
UncutTriggerInWA
Posts: 2692
Date Joined: 05/09/08
This is not about Jap whaling
It's pirates at work. I don't condone the whaling either but should we send terrorists out there to solve the problem? I don't think so.
Vince.
Work smart and fish often.
Member and die-hard supporter of the mighty West Coast Eagles.
damo6230
Posts: 2029
Date Joined: 07/06/08
Pirates and Terriorists in two sentances
who taught you english?
Tony Halliday
Posts: 2500
Date Joined: 14/06/07
I'm shocked that the
I'm shocked that the Australian Labor wooesssy goverment let the Jap Whaler into our Ecconomic Exclussion Zone Waters???? I thought all whlaing ships where banned from Australian controlled and patroled waters???
I wonder what weapons they had onboard as well, that they not wanting to be seen by our customs ship as well.
But biggest point of interstest is how quick we are to intercept, hold and prosecute people smugglers who bring people into Australia, yet here we stand and let a foriegn flagged ship leave australian ecconomic zone & custom waters with citizens on board without customs or immegration clearance..mmmm think guys think.
or is Rudd and Ginger Ninja + Roxon scared that if they send a ship and the Japs will not pull over if asked and just give them the figure and carry on knowing we a bunch of woooessses that need other countries navies to intercept and stop ships as we have no balls!!!!
Cause if they powerless over an interaction between a boat 16 nautical miles off our coast with a vessel from the australian main land, then every drug smuggler has a loop hole to go out and swop stuff out just 20 miles out to see???
hey I could have a nice new business oppertunity for me in my Donzi to smuggle people out of Australian and pay my fuel bill now...lol
pisses me off how Japan can just walk all over this country with a leader with no guts to stand up to them, bring back Frazer or Howard or any of those old stron Aussie leaders with balls!
Tony Halliday: ~Meals on Reels ~
It takes a strong fish to swim against the current. Even a dead one can float with it
"It is always in season for old men to learn." Aeschylus (525-456 BC)
"In a mad world only the mad are sane." Akira Kurosawa (1910-1998)
WADRay
Posts: 301
Date Joined: 20/12/09
I think you will find there
I think you will find there is a big diffenerce between our EEZ and our teritorial waters. We only really control our teritorial waters and thats the loop hole they can skip through to do anything they want.
By international law the vessel you are on follows the laws of its flag nation whilst on the high seas. IE a Japanese ship in the Aust EEZ is still japanese ground. This is similar to how consulates work (their ground is property and governed by their flag nation)
There is a few very interesting reviews written on this and why aussies will not allow these (sea shep) ships to fly the aussie flag. Also very interesting write ups on the collision between the whalers and the pirate vessel.
I hate labor Ill get that out of the way before I say anything else. But to say they are gutless when they are fighting a battle they clearly cannot win is narrow minded. Pick your fights and fight like shit I say. Fight the whaling hard if thats a fight you can win, I honestly doubt it is. Fact is while they are counted "our waters" we honestly have very little jurisdiction over them.
Rod P
Posts: 725
Date Joined: 20/05/08
Just to correct you the
Just to correct you the Brigitte Bardot is actually registered out of Australia. Fremantle to be exact.
The Steve Irwin is Dutch as for the support that the Dutch lottery's provide.
The SH 2 was 16.2 miles of the beach. That is Australian waters..
sarcasm0
Posts: 1396
Date Joined: 25/06/09
?
Am I missing something here?
Tony Halliday
Posts: 2500
Date Joined: 14/06/07
and as they where inside the
and as they where inside the 24 nautical mile zone, they would have had to comply to Australia Customs and Immigrations law, there by not leaving with citizens onboard that had not cleared customs....
Whats interesting is they shut off their location beacon which is also against Australian maritime law and codes, but I bet the GPS logs from the Shonan and the Steve Irwin would show that they where well inside the CZ boundary when boarded...
Tony Halliday: ~Meals on Reels ~
It takes a strong fish to swim against the current. Even a dead one can float with it
"It is always in season for old men to learn." Aeschylus (525-456 BC)
"In a mad world only the mad are sane." Akira Kurosawa (1910-1998)
Iceman
Posts: 749
Date Joined: 17/03/09
Act of piracy
Whilst I don't agree with Whaling I totally disagree with the actions of the greenies.
1. Last year they lost a boat and blamed the japs for raming them when it can be clearly seen that they (greenies) were the one who rammed the whaling vessel. It is the responsibility of all vessels to avoid a collision.
2. on a number of occasions they have collided with whaling vessels and it can be clearly seen that they (greenies)are at fault
3. this not the first time they have boarded a vessel without permission. Families claim they have been kidnapped.
I hope the Aust Govt does nothing to support them and that the jap govt throw them in jail. They are an embarrasment to the Australian people with their actions.
If they continue with these illegal activities out ports should refuse them access. No different to not allowing the whaling ships access as we consider their actions illegal.
That is my opinion.
PS: I quite often get stopped by greenies in the street wanting to ask me some questions and fill out a survey. I tell them to stop bothering me and get a real job.
Smartline Personal Mortgage Advisers - Level 1, 11 Hobsons Gate Currambine
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grayzeee
Posts: 2283
Date Joined: 09/07/09
Jeez , there is a real roll
Jeez , there is a real roll over and take it attitude from some here.
Good on anyone trying to do the right thing.
Totally agree Tony.
If I spent half as long fishing , as I do reading this bloody forum , I'd be twice the fisherman I am.
UncutTriggerInWA
Posts: 2692
Date Joined: 05/09/08
Roll over and take it???? I don't think so.
Just because I don't support terrorism or piracy you should not brand me in that manner. I have my opinion and don't get upset at yours (although the tone of this post is upsetting). These guys are hardly doing the right thing by illegally boarding a ship at sea.
Again, I am clearly against the whaling but even more annoyed at the antics of these radicals.
Vince.
Work smart and fish often.
Member and die-hard supporter of the mighty West Coast Eagles.
grayzeee
Posts: 2283
Date Joined: 09/07/09
trespassing .. yep ....
trespassing .. yep .... torrorism ... don't think so.
If I spent half as long fishing , as I do reading this bloody forum , I'd be twice the fisherman I am.
WADRay
Posts: 301
Date Joined: 20/12/09
See what they get thrown in
See what they get thrown in jail for and then work out what it is they have done.
It is an act of piracy to board a vessel at sea without a masters permission especially if you are then demanding the captain does what you tell him to. What would it be called if you did it on an aircraft? I wonder what they called it during 9/11??? Call it what you want they were breaking not just a nations laws but global laws and last I looked 2 wrongs dont make a right...
Maybe I am wrong on that though, maybe the world has changed since they are whaling...When did we stop can you tell me, kinda strange we are so all mighty innocent when we have people that are alive that were whaling out of WA.... Hypocricy.....(not saying its right just saying if you live in a glass house dont throw stones)...
Hairyone
Posts: 246
Date Joined: 26/12/09
Its a catch 22 situation I
Its a catch 22 situation I reckon............the greenies go in looking like a pack of feral dole bludgers or proffessional protestors and waste a lot of everyones money..............or.........the government stands back and does absolutely nothing.
Put both groups on a whaleing ship and sink the bloody lot of them, and we would all be better off!
pale ale
Posts: 1755
Date Joined: 02/01/10
Yep, sink em! Bloody Japs
Yep, sink em!
Bloody Japs trying to take over the world AGAIN!!! They think they own everything that swims.
JohnF
Posts: 2841
Date Joined: 07/07/10
Haha, that makes me a defacto
Haha, that makes me a defacto pirate, as I am a green peace member and happily contribute my tax deductible donation every month so these fellas can give the whalers a bit of curry.
I certainly don't agree with everything green peace does, but do agree with their whaling and pacific ocean tuna policies, hence my donation.
Give em hell I say....... Still, those lads have to expect eating sushi with a slight mammal texture in a free Japanese hotel for a year or two methinks.....the law of the open ocean and all......
Boston Whaler 235 Conquest......getting the flogging it was built for.
smash
Posts: 434
Date Joined: 01/12/10
actually not John
Greenpeace are totally opposed to Sea Shepherd and dont contribute a cracker to this campaign. Greenpeace kicked Paul Watson out 3 decades ago from memory.
Seems like Greenpeace only go for the soft targets like hang a banner when the US navy arrives, knowing theres no danger.
Tony Halliday
Posts: 2500
Date Joined: 14/06/07
Ignore the fact of what these
Ignore the fact of what these protestors have done " right or wrong"
BUT OPEN YOUR EYES TO OUR GOVERNMENTS INABILITY TO SAY "BOO" TO THE JAPANESE WHALING FLEET OR GOVERNMENT!!!!
This is not about supporting or not supporting Sea Sheppard, it's about our present governments inability to guard, control and protect our laws and coast!
that’s the big picture here that Sea Sheppard and the Forest Protestors have exposed.
It shows we a toothless, silly tiger with a yellow streak to stand up to any economic power that abuses us!
it shows we gutless in our present government to enforce our non whaling policy of our waters of interest and control and powerless by our lack of leadership to show we a world power when it comes to controlling our own ocean!
Hell Maggie Thatcher went to war over a few islands in the South Atlantic because it was British and may have some oil potential. That woman had balls and could stand up and pee with the best of them.
And Our polies??? mmmm no comment!
Tony Halliday: ~Meals on Reels ~
It takes a strong fish to swim against the current. Even a dead one can float with it
"It is always in season for old men to learn." Aeschylus (525-456 BC)
"In a mad world only the mad are sane." Akira Kurosawa (1910-1998)
Colt_Striker
Posts: 624
Date Joined: 26/07/09
So it looks like some of you
So it looks like some of you guy's here are supporting those peolpe who are also part of the groups trying to take away our Recreational fishing rights & area's, just because they have committed an illegal act agianst another culture. It was not a whaling ship it was a security ship.
Rod P
Posts: 725
Date Joined: 20/05/08
Are you serous Col. These
Are you serous Col. These people the SSCS group are trying to stop whaling mate. Not your recreational fishing rights.
Good news for anyone operating and fishing out at the bank. Apparently the Australian government has no legal jurisdiction past the 12nm line. Her words.
Good on them
Oh for& and for those of you who are interested in 2008 the Japanese whalers where taken to court and told they are not to enter with in the 200nm exclusion zone(for those that need help 14 miles is 186 miles inside that exclusion zone). Chile threatened them by saying if they crossed with in 1 mile of there waters they would arrest the whalers and there ship, guess what they turned around with in two miles of there waters. Shame we can't stop them here.
Wait till the Indonesians and other poachers start testing the new 12mile exclusion in court. Maybe then you'll hope the government would have stepped in and not played scared chicken.
Tony Halliday
Posts: 2500
Date Joined: 14/06/07
Rod, no foriegn country or
Rod, no foriegn country or major power has ever entered South African ecconomic waters and violated their laws or fishign rules, including whaling! why???? Same goes for people entering Russian waters, even the Japs hold Chinese fishing vessels at gun point if they come to close to Japan,..... not us hey!
Cause they not scared to sink the Fuggers in a flash!!! Do you remember our toothless Aussie navy chasing a patagonian toothfish poacher half way across the world, only for them to stop when the South African Navy was asked to help! Yip I know many of the crew on that ship and they where all itching to blow the buggers out the water for spoiling their shore-leave!
bottom line is we have become a toothless force in our own waters, only able to fight off pirates off Somalia and any group thats not part of a powerful nation. Bet the North Koreans could come down and fish here and we would bend over and cry sorry for getting in their way too!!
Tony Halliday: ~Meals on Reels ~
It takes a strong fish to swim against the current. Even a dead one can float with it
"It is always in season for old men to learn." Aeschylus (525-456 BC)
"In a mad world only the mad are sane." Akira Kurosawa (1910-1998)
Colt_Striker
Posts: 624
Date Joined: 26/07/09
Rod do you think these tree
Rod do you think these tree hugging hippies only belong to 1 greenie group. They belong to a few & all band together to try & stop us doing what we enjoy.
championruby
Posts: 459
Date Joined: 20/01/11
You eat and spout BS
You eat and spout BS propaganda by the bucketload mate.
Keep believing whatever your mates tell you...
Colt_Striker
Posts: 624
Date Joined: 26/07/09
Not exactly sure where you
Not exactly sure where you rant is directed mate, but this is fact confirmed by speaking to some of the tree huggers when they were walking the streets trying to gain signatures to have marine parks introduced. As I humoured them for half hour asking them questions about how the different environmental groups interacted with each other. I am not supporting whaling, but also do not support any of the green groups. Ask it from this perspective how would they react if the whalers boarded the SI???
championruby
Posts: 459
Date Joined: 20/01/11
I'm a big supporter of
I'm a big supporter of environmental causes, but have nothing against sustainable whaling if it is possible. The guys boarding ships are taking their protest a bit too far IMO.
It's directed at the fact that you are attempting to link a bunch of mad fools boarding a japanese vessel to everyone that has an interest in the environment. And then insinuating they are all "attacking our freedoms".
Just because someone wants to protect what little wilderness we have left, or save an endangered species doesn't automatically mean that they are against Rec fishing.
Thats what I take umbrage at.
Tony Halliday
Posts: 2500
Date Joined: 14/06/07
wrong colt, the Shonan Maru
wrong colt, the Shonan Maru no 2 is a full blown harpoon armed whaling ship.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MV_Sh%C5%8Dnan_Maru_2
http://www.flickr.com/photos/wietse/4507292787/
yes at the moment it has the guise of a security ship, but is still registered under maritime logs as a whaling ship.
Secondly many people that fish support Sea Sheppard. I have not seen Sea Sheppard post anything about taking away your individual right to fish, they more focused on the high take actions of large commercial fishing fleets and trawing, whaling and seal clubbing etc.
I'm anti Peta and other off the wall ecco mad-nutters, but I have held a position as a Chairman of a large RSPCA and have had dealings on board level with Green Peace and others. Many of them use the Ecco front as way to drive a big business machine thats their carreer and apsy them etc. Paul Watson in my mind has at least put his money, mouth and life on the line, for good or bad reasons what ever, I respect him for that.
I dont' support Green Peace, or Peta or the other lot, only the actions of Sea Sheppard in stopping whaling and dolphim hunting, sea clubing and long line death trap purse-nets or long line hooks
To allow Japan to take 1000 whales every year for the last twenty years for research is just cr@p! you know it, I know it, the world knows it's commercial whaling, using a method that takes a whlae over one to two hours to die a very painful death.
It's not the same as killing cows, sheep, pigs or even fish. There the method used area quick a less painful drawn out death. If I killed a cow for meat using a harpoon and had it dragged around behind a tractor alive and kicking for two hours before it died, all hell would brake out amongst people that saw it and no one could support it.
Harvesting whales is not possible by any means that gives a quick and painless death ( or short pain duration). There bulk does not allow for a humane killing method, and as such we should not be hunting a species that is very difficult to breed and keep.
I'm no ecco warrior, just a concerned fisherman and member of this country that is shocked at how we roll over, vasseline up and let the Japs rodger the be-jeeves out of us everytime they feel like it !
Tony Halliday: ~Meals on Reels ~
It takes a strong fish to swim against the current. Even a dead one can float with it
"It is always in season for old men to learn." Aeschylus (525-456 BC)
"In a mad world only the mad are sane." Akira Kurosawa (1910-1998)
Lamby
Posts: 3145
Date Joined: 04/08/09
Bang on Colt!It's not a
Bang on Colt!
It's not a whaling ship so what exactly were they trying to achieve?
Like it or not they have a quota of whales they are allowed to cull for 'research' - you might cry foul but that's what has been stipulated
The act of them boarding this vessel is piracy yet some may consider this to be such a noble & dashing deed, it remains an unlawful act & you better put down those Mills & Boon books.
These same people also want to remove your rec fishing rights, think about supporting a more viable alternative instead of lining the pockets & ego's of these extremists
Tony Halliday
Posts: 2500
Date Joined: 14/06/07
Lamby , she is a full blown,
Lamby , she is a full blown, harpoon armed whaler and still registered as such!
go look at the maritime ship register, google it and see whats she is registered as and who her owners are???
Tony Halliday: ~Meals on Reels ~
It takes a strong fish to swim against the current. Even a dead one can float with it
"It is always in season for old men to learn." Aeschylus (525-456 BC)
"In a mad world only the mad are sane." Akira Kurosawa (1910-1998)
Lamby
Posts: 3145
Date Joined: 04/08/09
Little cartoon angry faces or
Little cartoon angry faces or not Tony it may be registered as such but it is on security detail, regardless does it still negate an act of piracy?
till
Posts: 9358
Date Joined: 21/02/08
I think you might be lumping
I think you might be lumping a few too many of the likely faces and agendas together.
I don't think that Sea Shepherd really has an anti-recfishing agenda, least I've never seen one published.
I'm acquainted with the leader of the Greenpeace global oceans campaign organiser and they're primarily against commercial exploitation, not an anti-recfish agenda. They spend most of their time trying to educate consumers about how/what/where their fish meals come from.
Pew though, not buying that one!
Lamby
Posts: 3145
Date Joined: 04/08/09
Birds of a feather...Whilst I
Birds of a feather...
Whilst I have also never seen any published link I have met members that share anti rec fishing sentiment but then I would have to hold my hand up & say that I am tarring all with the same brush (sounds familiar)
To link in rec fishing diverts away from my thoughts on the matter - whilst it is still legal for the Japanese to obtain a quota of whales for 'research' then piracy is not the answer to oppose nor is endangering the lives of others with these actions on water. I just see a huge waste of resources funding ego driven extremists flying under the banner of conservation for whales (which the majority of opinions uphold) that could be best directed elsewhere.
Rant over
sea-kem
Posts: 15230
Date Joined: 30/11/09
When the facts come out of
When the facts come out of where that ship was situated Nicloa Roxon will be proven to be an embarrassment. What these guys are doing is what our Navy should be doing.Arrogant bloody Japs they'll never change.
Love the West!
Rod P
Posts: 725
Date Joined: 20/05/08
Lamby the law is actually
Lamby the law is actually that Commercial Whaling is banned. The Japanese say they are doing research. They as thats is the Japanese set the quota for what they want to kill.
Its the same as saying the Indonesians are setting a research vessel out to catch 100 tone WA Dhufish to do research on them. Now if what Nicola Roxen's office is peddling is true than as long as that vessels stays at least 12nm of our coast we can't touch them.
I know its a stretch but its the same law. Now if that was to happen, and we are banned from fishing for them what will you do? Will you protest them? Or would you just roll over and if some local fisho had huge cahooners and went out there would you support him or say he is just a pirate and deserves what he gets?
These are our waters and we should not roll over and take it from the Japanese. Truth is our government is scared sh-tless of them and what they will do.
Having said that the Japanese whaler's ( i should point out that this a government run organisation) said there ships would never ever be compromised again by having people boarding them. Well guess what 60 million dollars wasn't enough to stop SSCS and a group of West Aussies that i am proud to be associated with.
I will also say that i hope no one on here who criticise these brave men would ever consider taking laws into there own hands to protect there own stuff if they ever confront a person breaking and entering. Or damaging your car at the ramp because if you would that makes you a hypocrite.
smash
Posts: 434
Date Joined: 01/12/10
Rod sorry-bollocks
RodP you need to get to know the facts before posting-so do a few others here.
1/ when the International Whaling Commission (IWC) was formed, they needed to get some of the whaling countries involved or it was pointless. At the time quite a few whales were endangered.
2/ The way this was done was to allow the Japs a quota for "scientific research". Other whaling countries such as scandinavians do the same.
3/ No-one seems to protest the scandinavian countries cos they are low profile, yet they take just about as many as the japs.
4/ The "Australian Waters" in Antarctica are only recognized by the other countries that claim waters down there. No one else recognises this. Not even the International Court in the Hague.
5/ Japanese are not doing anything illegal. Immoral? maybe to many, but not illegal.
6/ Minke whales are not endangered. Is the anti-whaling fight because its immoral or for conservation?
7/ I dont believe it takes an hour to kill every whale hunted. It would be in noones best interests to persist with such a useless killing method. Maybe sometimes they dont die straight away, just as when shooting a fox or rabbit its near impossible to get 100% clean kill EVERY time.
8/ The japs are VERY close to getting a return to commercial whaling via the procedures set down by the IWC. It will be a bit rich if this happens and other countries boycott it cos its not doing what they want. THe IWC agreed very early on that after whale populations increase to safe levels a study (early 1990's) would be undertaken and quotas for some commercial whaling set.
Japan has requested this and the IWC has refused to undertake it.
I believe the Japs havent taken their quota of humpbacks etc for quite a while (though they could lie about it as per SBT)
Note the above is only off the top of my head, I havent googled or searched comprehensively.
The Japs are lying scumbags (see SBT quotas), but the people need to decide WHY they are against whaling.
Cos theyre endangered? Its immoral? theyre cute? cos theyre like us
Im not arguing for or against-just putting a few facts (as my memory remembers them) out there.
WADRay
Posts: 301
Date Joined: 20/12/09
Very well posted
Very well posted
Rod P
Posts: 725
Date Joined: 20/05/08
Sorry its not well posted
Sorry its not well posted at all.
Im not sure where you googled and what you read but your the one who needs to stand corrected.
7 and 8 are the only two you could say have some form of truth. The rest your simply wrong.
I understand my points. In fact as a financial member of SSCS as well as few other organizations i do my research properly.
The IWC has said no to whaling. There is a loop hole for Research that the Jap's work under. they are the only ones that call it that. The other whaling countries just said stiff we'll whale if we want to. Fact
The IWC is run by loads of countries. In Fact just about anyone can be a member. The biggest issue is that Japan sponsors and pays for many smaller countries to be members. In fact this year the only real change was a law was brought in that membership fees for countries can no longer be paid for in CASH. One very important vote was put forward and when Japan couldn't stop it they got up, ordered the countries they paid for to also walk out, therefor a formal vote could not take place as a majority of members were not available.
The IWC numbers for whales and the Japanese numbers for how many whales differ greatly. Fin whales are less than 5000 in the world(estimated) yet they are still targeted.
Whales or not, if this was the African jungles and these were great elephants, lions or any of the other big creatures on the planet what would we all say?
The ocean is a amazing place, one for which i derive a living and do i want to to see it dead and gone? NO so will i continue to talk up or should i stick my head in the sand and say huh, its a big place who knows?
smash
Posts: 434
Date Joined: 01/12/10
OK Rod
from the Australian Governments Antartic website-Minke Whales-
quote "Minkes are the only baleen whale species which is still common in Antarctic waters
Conservation status: least concern".
Note they are not fin whales.
Iceland Norway and Japan all have research quotas, partly under a clause allowed due to their objection to the IWC refusal to undertake the study I mentioned.
From a research paper by Dr Chris McGrath;
quote "Leaving aside the AAT’s status under Australian domestic law, it can be noted that
sovereignty over Antarctica is a sensitive international topic and only the United Kingdom,
France, Norway and New Zealand officially recognise Australian sovereignty over the AAT."
The rest, mostly can be confirmed by looking at the IWC website.
If you have a look you'll find it.
As said though it may sound that way, Im not for whaling. But spouting complete falacy only serves to make protesters look foolish.
"theres none so blind as those who dont WANT to see"
Rod P
Posts: 725
Date Joined: 20/05/08
Iceland and Norway don't
Iceland and Norway don't whale under the jise of Research. They simply refuse to be told and are not members of the IWC.
Minke whales are of least concern. That does not say enough to kill. In fact the numbers of many whales would astound you. 5000 fin whales and they are still targeted. You do also release that the Japanese not only kill Minke whales they are also targeting Southern Right whales and humpbacks.
Do you also know that the only research papers released by the ICR say that they eat fish.
As for the whalers breaking laws.
Bunker C fuel is not permitted bellow the 60th parallel and they run bunker c fuel
No re fueling is allowed and they refuel.
In fact the stupid RED head running this country is also saying loud and clear that they are breaking the law by whaling teh SOuthern ocean. She's just not stopping it. We are taking them to court but it is expected to be 5 years. A simple request for a injunction now would stop it straight away until the court date.
In fact just yesterday the Japanese whale ship the SM3 is now in Australian waters. They have been told by our Government to leave immediately and they are refusing mate.
You also said no one protests the European nations. Well SSCS has been up in there the last three years. The funny thing is the only reason SSCS can intervene is if they are breaking the law. SSCS will stop poachers not true fisherman. I would have though that is a good thing for the average fisho?
The biggest issue with whaling is that the gene pool is too low already many experts are saying.
smash
Posts: 434
Date Joined: 01/12/10
RodP
heres a list of all the IWC members (89) straight from their website
Antigua & Barbuda Argentina Australia Austria Belgium Belize Benin Brazil Bulgaria Cambodia Cameroon Chile China, People's Rep of Colombia Congo, Rep of the Costa Rica Côte d'Ivoire Croatia Cyprus Czech Republic Denmark Dominica Dominican Republic Ecuador Eritrea Estonia Finland France Gabon Gambia, The Germany Ghana, Rep of Greece Grenada Guatemala Guinea-Bissau Guinea, Rep of Hungary Iceland India Ireland Israel Italy Japan Kenya Kiribati Korea, Rep of Laos Lithuania Luxembourg Mali Marshall Islands, Rep of Mauritania Mexico Monaco Mongolia Morocco Nauru The Netherlands New Zealand Nicaragua Norway Oman Palau Panama Peru Poland Portugal Romania Russian Federation San Marino St. Kitts & Nevis St. Lucia St. Vincent & The Grenadines Senegal Slovak Republic Slovenia Solomon Islands South Africa Spain Suriname Sweden Switzerland Tanzania Togo Tuvalu UK Uruguay USAa couple of posts back you were knocking people giving wrong info and not admitting it. Look above and you'll see Norway and Iceland are members. Is the IWC lying?
Here once again is the text straight from the IWC website about scientific whaling. Why would the IWC lie?
"Since the ‘moratorium’ came into effect after 1986, Japan, Norway and Iceland have issued scientific permits as part of their research programmes. In recent years, only Japan and Iceland have issued permits."
Lamby
Posts: 3145
Date Joined: 04/08/09
Rod I respect your opinion on
Rod I respect your opinion on here & agree that it's thinly veiled commercial whaling under the guise of 'research'
Whilst at a stretch I also see the dilemma posed with 'Indo Dhuie Research' but would I resort to piracy to support this? No, would I protest it? Yes. Same thoughts apply for whaling, I just don't support acts of piracy or flagrant abuse of maritime law to make my point.
Just because I may support something strongly I still do not think I am above the law to embrace my cause, why even have laws... mm might support anarchism
Rod P
Posts: 725
Date Joined: 20/05/08
I agree Lamby and respect
I agree Lamby and respect your opinion but i have issue when people say its okay to defend a position that they feel is important but attack others that protest what they think is a injustice.
Just for the record SSCS will only intervene against someone who is breaking the law. For instance in Japan at Taiji they sit everyday and photograph and publish the dolphin slaughter everyday. Telling the world what is happening but they will not interfere, as it is not against the law what the Dolphin killers are doing. The Whalers in the Southern ocean and our Perth waters that is against the law. Not only our Australian laws, but also the IWC's as well.
Lamby
Posts: 3145
Date Joined: 04/08/09
Likewise for the top
Likewise for the top paragraph
For the second I might need to research this more but I understood that their quota may come from international waters & had not heard that culling was conducted in Australasian water?
Hairyone
Posts: 246
Date Joined: 26/12/09
Well just to throw another
Well just to throw another spanner in the works.........didnt the Japs just get hit by a bloody great Tsunami and the world came running to their aid with money? Apparently we gave them a shit load.........
Well....I heard on the ABC (beleive what you want from the media) that the Japs admited spending a heap of our money financing the Whaleing fleet........and the Japaneese spokesperson on the radio said it was justified, as some of the villages taken out in the Tsunami were whaleing villages.
IF its true......talk about laughing in or faces and rubbing our noses in it!!!!!!
Dan
Posts: 168
Date Joined: 23/02/06
so Australia is apparently
so Australia is apparently soft on a japanese vessel that is not currently whaling
but there's a fanfare and cheer when a bunch of nutters arrive on a foreign registered vessel; accused of piracy activities named the steve Irwin are welcomed to our shores. Why does Paul Watson as a US citzen not get his vessel registered under a US flag ? - what is he afraid of ??
The whole of whaling is a emotive crock of sh!t !
The Japs would be far better off to say "you know what, we're no longer doing research, we're just gonna hunt whales. This is how many we're going to take (sustainably) see ya later"
Whales didn't go to the brink of extinction due to the Japanese - who at least harvest & utilise the whole animal; compared in the past to Australia (historically one of the biggest whalers in the southern hemisphere), USA, Africa etc who just melted it down for oil
Whales trigger an emotive chord in so many people; yet don't flinch when it comes to slaughtering a dhuie/mackie or shoot a roo etc. Whaling may no longer be our cup of tea; but what right do we have to dictate to others
I would have no problem with a whaling program that was done in a sustainable manner - same as every other thing we harvest from the wild. The green groups use these highly emotive & iconic species as a veil to mislead.
Normally the biggest banner on any environmental organisations website is the 'DONATE' Button.
uncle
Posts: 9643
Date Joined: 10/02/07
well said Dan
WITH 7 BILLION PEOPLE ON THIS PLANET AND COUNTLESS DOGS AND CATS, ITS ONLY A MATTER OF TIME BEFORE THE WORLD SUSTAINABLY HARVESTS WHALES
all aggressive fish love bigjohnsjigs
Willlo
Posts: 1490
Date Joined: 07/10/11
Save the whales,save the
Save the whales,save the sharks,save the trees.These greenies if given an inch will take a mile if it was up to them we would all be eating lentils.These idiots think they can board a vessel with no comebacks get real try get on my boat without an invite and see how you fare.They are proffesional protestors(another term for dole bludger)They should have been tagged and released straight back into the sea.I thought the great Peter Garret got in with the labour party to save the whales, soon as he spoke out he was promptly given another portfolio. I dont agree that it should be open season on whales or any sealife for that matter but sustainable harvesting is ok by me. Its not up to vigilantes to fix the problem what we need is a govt with balls to let these japs know we dont want them whaling in our waters.That whaling ship or security ship would make a great reef we could put it out from the Lena.
Call Sign - BZ785
Haynes Hunter Prowler CC
sea-kem
Posts: 15230
Date Joined: 30/11/09
Thanks Willo you got my point
Thanks Willo you got my point accross better than me.
Love the West!
Rod P
Posts: 725
Date Joined: 20/05/08
Just for the record for SSCS
Just for the record for SSCS its more about save ourselves. We need to ocean, alive though producing oxygen. I guess some people seem to think we can live on this planet with out it.
I want oxygen for my kids, hell they can do with out whales, they can do with out sharks, they could maybe even live with out trees, but sadly i can't see them surviving with out oxygen.
Im not a scientist, but i'm also not a idoit and i can read reports that say we need to ocean alive and healthy or we will lose 60 to 70% of our oxygen supply.
out wide
Posts: 1535
Date Joined: 30/12/08
We said Willlo
Rod P
Posts: 725
Date Joined: 20/05/08
Actually to be correct Dan
Actually to be correct Dan Paul Watson is a Canadian citizen not a US as you state. He also registers his ship the SI in Dutch waters as they were the only country not to bow to pressure from Japan. Also the Dutch lottery supports them well so they fly there flag proudly. Also you should note whilst being factual that the SI is only registered as a private vessel. That also allows for certain clauses that they are able to flaunt. (why wouldn't they)
The fact is that whaling is not sustainable......... So how can they still hunt them sustainably.
Most fish in the world are entering into dangerous levels but they are still hunted. Japan work on the Economics of extinction. If they have years of meat in the freezers and they can hunt that animal to extinction then there profit levels will go through the roof. A blue fin tuna apparently just sold for $750000 dollars. You'd know that better. Problem is some people are all for sustainable fishing practices but sadly the Japanese don't play that card.
Australia is a Whale free nation (actually not 100% but that's another story). We make an estimated $300 million a year in tourism from Whale's so the Japanese coming to our waters and killing the whales will also have a direct knock on effect to our country's tourism.
Tony Halliday
Posts: 2500
Date Joined: 14/06/07
ok so Mz Roxon says they
ok so Mz Roxon says they will be dropped off at the vessels next port of call, ie back in Japan in two months time....
and we as Australians have no say further out than 12~16NM from shore in who leaves and enters our waters on a vessel, even if they illegally boarded it.....
so here is my business plan.
I'm going to charter a big bloody ship and have a planned sailing route from Indo to Perth every month.
Then I'm going to anchor off Indonesia and have dozens of chaps climb aboard illegally on my vessel. Those with $5000 on them, I'll confiscate (those without I’ll toss to the sharks ) and when I reach Perth off load them at my port of call, so by stealing all the business of the peoples smugglers by a loophole given to me by the Minister in charge and AT of our country,,,, thank you Roxy for the business opportunity...
she has created the legal precedent, so it will stick and illegal migrants can flow into Perth instead of Christmas Island and not be touched by the law till they 16 NM off our coast????
Am I wrong or is she bending the law to what flies on the day???
Tony Halliday: ~Meals on Reels ~
It takes a strong fish to swim against the current. Even a dead one can float with it
"It is always in season for old men to learn." Aeschylus (525-456 BC)
"In a mad world only the mad are sane." Akira Kurosawa (1910-1998)
UncutTriggerInWA
Posts: 2692
Date Joined: 05/09/08
I'll base my judgements on legal opinions
I have listened carefully today with interest to people who actually know what they are talking about.. That's the law professors at ANU. They actually support anti-whaling but have heaps to say about how silly these guys were based on what happened previously. Now I hear the dickheads are throwing a hunger strike.. Don't they like whale burgers..... I don't care how much you rant Tony this is a delicate situation created by radicals who seem to think they can take the law into their own hands and then demand that governements bow to their actions, much like kidnappers and terrorists.
Illegal immigrants are another problem and have nothing to do with what is under debate here.
Vince.
Work smart and fish often.
Member and die-hard supporter of the mighty West Coast Eagles.
Willlo
Posts: 1490
Date Joined: 07/10/11
Agree Vince, maybe we should
Agree Vince, maybe we should bring in the Judean Peoples Front or was that the Peoples Front Of Judea (Life Of Brian) LOL
Call Sign - BZ785
Haynes Hunter Prowler CC
UncutTriggerInWA
Posts: 2692
Date Joined: 05/09/08
LOL
Yes. Maybe that will help.
Vince.
Work smart and fish often.
Member and die-hard supporter of the mighty West Coast Eagles.
Starbug
Posts: 563
Date Joined: 27/08/09
PFJ..... Bloody spliters.
PFJ..... Bloody spliters. :)
sea-kem
Posts: 15230
Date Joined: 30/11/09
We may have a little job for
We may have a little job for you Brian :)
Love the West!
fishy fingers
Posts: 1719
Date Joined: 28/04/07
that should be Bwian!
get it right!!!
sea-kem
Posts: 15230
Date Joined: 30/11/09
Nah that was the
Nah that was the Emporer....I have a vewy gweat fwend in Rome called Bigus dickus lol
Love the West!
deezydee
Posts: 109
Date Joined: 05/12/10
I want a bag of gravel for
I want a bag of gravel for the stoning.
Willlo
Posts: 1490
Date Joined: 07/10/11
Tony the fact is that the
Tony the fact is that the professional protestors F&^cked up. They are so used to being treated in a nice humane way they thought the japs would be the same.Remember these guys are not members of Sea Shep but another group based down here in bunno i think that are dedicated to saving verge trees etc. I think its a classic stuff up on their account and have just earned a free holiday to Japan via the Antartic, just hope it doesnt cost any of our tax money to get them back.
As for MZ Roxon you are right but then where is she diff from any other polly, she will get told of by the boss and retract everything later down the track.
Rod you are also correct the japanese dont play by the same rules as everyone else, thats why we need a govt with balls not vigilantes.As for your other comment re defending ones house or car at the boat ramp and being a hypocrite if you do, i cant see the comparison these guys layed in wait of the japs then boarded there boat. They were not protecting there own stuff by doing that ,all they were doing was trying to justify there own beliefs in an ilegal manner. if by that comment you meant they were protecting Australias whaling interests well lets just leave that kind of thing to the authorities.
Call Sign - BZ785
Haynes Hunter Prowler CC
Dan
Posts: 168
Date Joined: 23/02/06
I stand corrected on the citizenship issue
Rod,
but perhaps it is less highlighted that when his former vessel was registered with US, he was threatened with being thrown in jail by coast guard for dangerous activities at sea; as have many other flag states where he has requested registering - wouldn't think that's just to do with pressure from Japan
no a lot publicised these days about his activism in canadian forests where they used to drive steel stakes into trees that were gazetted for (legal) logging. several chainsaw operators - just doing their job sustained some nasty injuries for that activism - that sort of crap doesn't sit well with me.
who says whaling is not sustainable ? if the amount harvested is less than the replacement reproduction level.... it would be sustainable
there has NEVER been a species of fish on record that had gone extinct due to commercial fishing
that $750k tuna was a promotional stunt for the start of the season - just like the 1st box of cherries at the start of Xmas (in Sydney they normally sell for $20-30k a box) the buyer owned a chain of restuarants - cheap publicity for him to attract people to his stores where they would be eating the fish at 1/10th of the sale price (ie he would've sold it at a loss)
deezydee
Posts: 109
Date Joined: 05/12/10
Orange ruffy must be very
Orange ruffy must be very close Dan, with the pategonian tooth fish catching up quickly.
Tony Halliday
Posts: 2500
Date Joined: 14/06/07
Bottom line folks is that no
Bottom line folks is that no matter how much our little yap dogs in our goverment bark, the Japs have no respect for them.
They would never try this stunt with other nations with a record of sinking pirate fishing ships and vessels!
Dan we both know that it's not so much the sustainable aspect of whaling, but the cruel maner they killed that is the biggest hurdle to overcome.
Jap could just go off and whale like the bunch in the northern hemisphere and not be part of the convetion, instead they use a loop hole that should have been closed years ago.
But back to the real issue of how a vessel classed as a whaler was allowed to enter and leave our ecconomic zone against a goverment ruling on this? and no action taken?
http://www.smh.com.au/environment/whale-watch/japanese-whalers-security-ship-enters-australian-waters-20120104-1pk1r.html
ignore the activists they small fry, the elephant in the room is the actions of the Japanese whaler entering our EEZ and flouting the ban on them by the goverment!!!
http://www.hsi.org.au/editor/assets/legal/HSI_Technical_Bulletin_Japanese_whaling_case.pdf
please read page 3 " enforcement " and see the bigger picture!
Tony Halliday: ~Meals on Reels ~
It takes a strong fish to swim against the current. Even a dead one can float with it
"It is always in season for old men to learn." Aeschylus (525-456 BC)
"In a mad world only the mad are sane." Akira Kurosawa (1910-1998)
allrounder
Posts: 1853
Date Joined: 10/11/08
Not that i support whaling Tony but you made an
interesting statement there.If i can quote you." They would never try this stunt with nations with a record of sinking pirate ships and vessels"If japan took this line in maritime law then there would be no posts here because they would have blown the sea shephard vessels away by now. Piracy is piracy.
So tell me have you got your info from years on the water or hours on the internet?
Tony Halliday
Posts: 2500
Date Joined: 14/06/07
piracy and sinking protest vessels!
remember the French tried that with Green Peace and their nuke program in the Pacific and see what happend to them???
Technically Sea Sheppard is not braking any maritime law, they do board vessels, but never sieze control or violate the crew or take anything. Technically they are squatters or stow-aways. Not Pirates...
definition of piracy:
http://www.maritimeterrorism.com/definitions/
Defining Maritime Terrorism:
The Council for Security Cooperation in the Asia Pacific (CSCAP) Working Group has offered an extensive definition for maritime terrorism:
“…the undertaking of terrorist acts and activities within the maritime environment, using or against vessels or fixed platforms at sea or in port, or against any one of their passengers or personnel, against coastal facilities or settlements, including tourist resorts, port areas and port towns or cities.”
This definition, however, does not define what terrorism is and whether it would only include maritime attacks against civilian (merchant) vessels or also attacks against military crafts. I define maritime terrorism, therefore, as the use or threat of violence against a ship (civilian as well as military), its passengers or sailors, cargo, a port facility, or if the purpose is solely a platform for political ends. The definition can be expanded to include the use of the maritime transportation system to smuggle terrorists or terrorist materials into the targeted country. Maritime terrorism is motivated by political goals beyond the immediate act of attacking a maritime target.
Defining Piracy:
Piracy, in contradistinction, according to article 101 of the 1982 United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea (UNCLOS) is defined as:
1. “any illegal acts of violence or detention, or any act of depredation, committed for private ends by the crew or the passengers of a private ship or a private aircraft, and directed: (i) on the high seas, against another ship or aircraft, or against persons or property on board such ship or aircraft; (ii) against a ship, aircraft, persons or property in a place outside the jurisdiction of any State;
2. any act of voluntary participation in the operation of a ship or of an aircraft with knowledge of facts making it a pirate ship or aircraft;
3. any act inciting or of intentionally facilitating an act described in sub-paragraph (a) or (b).”
The UNCLOS definition of piracy developed into international law and the International Maritime Organization (IMO)8 recognized and accepted this definition. Thus, according to international law, any illegal acts of violence and detention which are committed within State’s territorial waters are not defined as piracy. However, according to the IMB, nearby all illegal acts in Southeast Asia occur within territorial waters and thus would not fall under the definition of piracy. Technically, if an attack occurs within the territorial jurisdiction of a state, the event is only classified as piracy if that nation’s penal code criminalizes it as such. Moreover, the IMO defines any unlawful act of violence or detention or any act of depredation at anchor, off ports or when underway through a coastal State’s territorial waters as armed robbery against ships.
In order to overcome the distinctions between high seas and territorial waters, the IMB defines piracy as:
“an act of boarding (or attempted boarding) with the intent to commit theft or any other crime and with the intent or capability to use force in furtherance of that act.”
Established by the International Chamber of Commerce (ICC) in 1981, the International Maritime Bureau (IMB) came into existence with the backing of the IMO, the world’s foremost agency for exchanging and collecting information on maritime crime. However, according to the IMO, it is estimated that piracy incidents are likely under-reported by a factor of two (meaning, they assume that for each attack that was announced, there were two additional attacks that were not announced). Moreover, it is likely that the statistics are subject to distortion as many smaller attacks go unreported. This mainly stems from two factors:
1. the increase in insurance premiums often outweigh the value of the claim for smaller attacks; and
2. Reporting a piracy attack is often time-consuming can lead to a delay of several days. Keeping in mind the running sunk costs of an idle ship (up to $25,000 per day), in many, especially smaller cases, it is cheaper not to report the incident.
While this wider definition allows the IMB to produce a more comprehensive picture about maritime crime, its definition is not recognized by international law.
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
this is the section that counts:
In order to overcome the distinctions between high seas and territorial waters, the IMB defines piracy as:
“an act of boarding (or attempted boarding) with the intent to commit theft or any other crime and with the intent or capability to use force in furtherance of that act.”
Tony Halliday: ~Meals on Reels ~
It takes a strong fish to swim against the current. Even a dead one can float with it
"It is always in season for old men to learn." Aeschylus (525-456 BC)
"In a mad world only the mad are sane." Akira Kurosawa (1910-1998)
Tony Halliday
Posts: 2500
Date Joined: 14/06/07
http://www.maritimeterrorism.com/definitions/
bugger having issues pasting to the site!
try again...
remember the French tried that with Green Peace and their nuke program in the Pacific and see what happened to them???
Technically Sea Sheppard is not braking any maritime law, they do board vessels, but never seize control or violate the crew or take anything. Technically they are squatters or stow-aways. Not Pirates...
definition of piracy:
http://www.maritimeterrorism.com/definitions/
Defining Maritime Terrorism:
The Council for Security Cooperation in the Asia Pacific (CSCAP) Working Group has offered an extensive definition for maritime terrorism:
“…the undertaking of terrorist acts and activities within the maritime environment, using or against vessels or fixed platforms at sea or in port, or against any one of their passengers or personnel, against coastal facilities or settlements, including tourist resorts, port areas and port towns or cities.”
This definition, however, does not define what terrorism is and whether it would only include maritime attacks against civilian (merchant) vessels or also attacks against military crafts. I define maritime terrorism, therefore, as the use or threat of violence against a ship (civilian as well as military), its passengers or sailors, cargo, a port facility, or if the purpose is solely a platform for political ends. The definition can be expanded to include the use of the maritime transportation system to smuggle terrorists or terrorist materials into the targeted country. Maritime terrorism is motivated by political goals beyond the immediate act of attacking a maritime target.
Defining Piracy:
Piracy, in contradistinction, according to article 101 of the 1982 United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea (UNCLOS) is defined as:
1. “any illegal acts of violence or detention, or any act of depredation, committed for private ends by the crew or the passengers of a private ship or a private aircraft, and directed: (i) on the high seas, against another ship or aircraft, or against persons or property on board such ship or aircraft; (ii) against a ship, aircraft, persons or property in a place outside the jurisdiction of any State;
2. any act of voluntary participation in the operation of a ship or of an aircraft with knowledge of facts making it a pirate ship or aircraft;
3. any act inciting or of intentionally facilitating an act described in sub-paragraph (a) or (b).”
The UNCLOS definition of piracy developed into international law and the International Maritime Organization (IMO)8 recognized and accepted this definition. Thus, according to international law, any illegal acts of violence and detention which are committed within State’s territorial waters are not defined as piracy. However, according to the IMB, nearby all illegal acts in Southeast Asia occur within territorial waters and thus would not fall under the definition of piracy. Technically, if an attack occurs within the territorial jurisdiction of a state, the event is only classified as piracy if that nation’s penal code criminalizes it as such. Moreover, the IMO defines any unlawful act of violence or detention or any act of depredation at anchor, off ports or when underway through a coastal State’s territorial waters as armed robbery against ships.
In order to overcome the distinctions between high seas and territorial waters, the IMB defines piracy as:
“an act of boarding (or attempted boarding) with the intent to commit theft or any other crime and with the intent or capability to use force in furtherance of that act.”
Established by the International Chamber of Commerce (ICC) in 1981, the International Maritime Bureau (IMB) came into existence with the backing of the IMO, the world’s foremost agency for exchanging and collecting information on maritime crime. However, according to the IMO, it is estimated that piracy incidents are likely under-reported by a factor of two (meaning, they assume that for each attack that was announced, there were two additional attacks that were not announced). Moreover, it is likely that the statistics are subject to distortion as many smaller attacks go unreported. This mainly stems from two factors:
1. the increase in insurance premiums often outweigh the value of the claim for smaller attacks; and
2. Reporting a piracy attack is often time-consuming can lead to a delay of several days. Keeping in mind the running sunk costs of an idle ship (up to $25,000 per day), in many, especially smaller cases, it is cheaper not to report the incident.
While this wider definition allows the IMB to produce a more comprehensive picture about maritime crime, its definition is not recognized by international law.
>>>this is the section that counts:
In order to overcome the distinctions between high seas and territorial waters, the IMB defines piracy as:
“an act of boarding (or attempted boarding) with the intent to commit theft or any other crime and with the intent or capability to use force in furtherance of that act.”
Tony Halliday: ~Meals on Reels ~
It takes a strong fish to swim against the current. Even a dead one can float with it
"It is always in season for old men to learn." Aeschylus (525-456 BC)
"In a mad world only the mad are sane." Akira Kurosawa (1910-1998)
allrounder
Posts: 1853
Date Joined: 10/11/08
Wow good googling there Tony
All it does is prove the piont . They did a pirate act and now they may spend 7 months going threw Japanesse courts.I agree with what they are trying to do i dont agree with how they conduct themselves.Until what they are doing is internationally illegal then they (unfortunately) are within their legal rights.What would you call it if i came along side and then borded your new drug running style boat.
So tell me have you got your info from years on the water or hours on the internet?
Tony Halliday
Posts: 2500
Date Joined: 14/06/07
you'd need to catch up to me
you'd need to catch up to me first lol...
and i'd leave you on the nearest FAD
Tony Halliday: ~Meals on Reels ~
It takes a strong fish to swim against the current. Even a dead one can float with it
"It is always in season for old men to learn." Aeschylus (525-456 BC)
"In a mad world only the mad are sane." Akira Kurosawa (1910-1998)
allrounder
Posts: 1853
Date Joined: 10/11/08
lol.
I will just wait until you run out of fuel
Did you also know that the Steve Irwin crew refused to lower the jolly rodger while in the port of fremantle.The government needs to crack down on both sides.They are just two groups of pirates fighting it out in the southern oceans.
So tell me have you got your info from years on the water or hours on the internet?
Tony Halliday
Posts: 2500
Date Joined: 14/06/07
yeah i loved the comment by
yeah i loved the comment by the harbour master that the skull and crossbones could be itimidating and frighting to other mariner...lol
god help them on Australia Day in two weeks time....lol when dozens of southern crosses and jolly rodgers will be flying...
ps you will have a long wait, as I have enough fuel in that brute for about 11 hours running
at 35 knots!!!!
filled her up at the bowser in Freo last wed and clocked the guage!!!!
as for the Whalers vs Steve Irwin, they may be not the best boys on the block to fight the cause of saving the whales, but they the only ones out there at the moment! Without them the japs would be over 3000 whales up in there take over the last few years!!!!
Tony Halliday: ~Meals on Reels ~
It takes a strong fish to swim against the current. Even a dead one can float with it
"It is always in season for old men to learn." Aeschylus (525-456 BC)
"In a mad world only the mad are sane." Akira Kurosawa (1910-1998)
Lamby
Posts: 3145
Date Joined: 04/08/09
Lol it was a case of tldr;
Lol it was a case of tldr; for me thanks for the snapshot, oh the irony Tony.... The irony
WADRay
Posts: 301
Date Joined: 20/12/09
HAHAHA I love it the reports
HAHAHA I love it the reports main source of "credible" information is a guy that has been found wanting in credibility every single time he has talked. Read some reviews done by the government and find out they guy has given false info EVERY report he has made to the aussie government....Even seashep cant get their storys strait between each other. If you listen to him the collision happened 100nm away from where it was initially reported AND from where their becons went off AND from where the Japs reported it...why Because it ment the japs were in Aussie waters... Soft target and the lieing prick went for it not expecting to get caught by the average run of the mill thick headed aussie who love his sob story... Incase you dont know Im talking about the honourable (heheh) Paul Watson.
Read something that isnt published by seashep and maybe you will find some facts to swallow.
Rod P
Posts: 725
Date Joined: 20/05/08
I guess you read that on the
I guess you read that on the ICR website.
Not sure what your actually even talking about. Please explain what confrontation your talking.
If your talking the boarding of the Three tree activists that the coordinates were 16.2 mn on the beach. Proof has been supplied from SSCS and after proof has been requested of the location given by the SM 2 they have no said they will drop the Aussie's off. Why are the letting them go? Because they fucked up and let there vessel be boarded in Aussie waters. The truth is at least Japan has finally realised the facts will prove that.
They will however get the Aussie government to do what they want. Send a Aussie customs ship to the Southern Ocean. I wonder if when we get there will we then demand the Japanese whaling fleet out of the area. See its also against the Antarctic law to operate in the waters with Bunker C heavy fuel..
Sadly there is so much miss information flying on here its not funny..
Tony Halliday
Posts: 2500
Date Joined: 14/06/07
in blunt terms of the court
in blunt terms of the court actions of 207 to 2009, if the Shonan Maru no 2 is found inside the EEZ or returns to an Australian port it can be siezed by the Federal Admiralty Marshal under Admiralty Rules 1988 and the Goverment could not stop it as it's a legal matter under a court sieze and sale notice.
Also if the Goverment knew that the Shonan Maru no 2 was inside the EEZ and did not act on the outstanding warrant of arrest and siezure, then questions need to be asked why they flouted a court order and ruling?
If they did not know??? then even bigger questions need to be asked about our border security and the ability of a vessel armed with explosives ( harpoon heads) entering and leaving our waters without our navy being aware of it???
They dammed either way!!!!
Tony Halliday: ~Meals on Reels ~
It takes a strong fish to swim against the current. Even a dead one can float with it
"It is always in season for old men to learn." Aeschylus (525-456 BC)
"In a mad world only the mad are sane." Akira Kurosawa (1910-1998)
allrounder
Posts: 1853
Date Joined: 10/11/08
They have no harpoon s on the vessel
And there for no explosives.
So tell me have you got your info from years on the water or hours on the internet?
Tony Halliday
Posts: 2500
Date Joined: 14/06/07
says who???? I'd be very
says who????
I'd be very shocked if they did not have harpoons onboard with heads and few other toys not allowed in Aussie waters too,,,,,
Once you have worked with some nations, you quickly learn they don't play by the rules, and seldom tell the full truth..
Tony Halliday: ~Meals on Reels ~
It takes a strong fish to swim against the current. Even a dead one can float with it
"It is always in season for old men to learn." Aeschylus (525-456 BC)
"In a mad world only the mad are sane." Akira Kurosawa (1910-1998)
UncutTriggerInWA
Posts: 2692
Date Joined: 05/09/08
Splitting hairs again mate
So now you are treating the vessel as a warship and not a security ship? The question of border security is high on most people's agendas Tony. Debate has been raging for yonks now as to how much money we should spend securing our borders, given their expanse. Again; irrelevant to the debate happening here which is focussed on the issue of 3 radicals unlawfully boarding a vessel at sea and what might happen to them.
Seriously Tony, how would you resolve this situation in reality? Forget your fantasy world and all the Googling. The Sea Shepherd is generating heaps of publicity. Unfortunatly the group are also generating some very critical commentary when it comes to their methods of operation. I wonder how long it will be before the mother ship takes a hit due to erratic behaviour and then cries out for condemnation.
All of your issues with the current government can be raised and voted upon at the next election. Until then, there are processes in place to handle these issues whether we agree with them or not.
Vince.
Work smart and fish often.
Member and die-hard supporter of the mighty West Coast Eagles.
Tony Halliday
Posts: 2500
Date Joined: 14/06/07
Honestly, I'd use a customs
Honestly, I'd use a customs ship to heave over the Whalers and serve the warrant of Justice CJ Black & J Finkelstein, upheld by Justice J Allsop in the high court.
The same way the Americans would, the British did in the cod wars, the same way the Japanese did to a Chinsese vessel last month!
at what risk will Japan take whaling too if it ment we swopped our aliance from them to other powers for ecconomic trade?
Japan is deeper in the Sh!t than the USA or any of the other PIIGS in Europe, they just very quiet about the fact they got a negative ecconomy thats stalling all the time! We now so boosted by other Eastern Asain trading nations, we could risk as stouch with Japan and they would compramise, they would want something in return, say a mining rights agreement or other fishing grounds in exchange for stopping whaling.
You dont see them going north and hunting whales from the USA / Mexico coastal region that migrate north to Alaska do you???
Thats a much closer hunting ground than our side of the planet! yet the travel much further to hunt our whales ... why???? cause they can and wont be stopped by us! but will be stopped by the USA if they tried that stunt that side!
it's all about the size of your stick and your willingness to use it! All bullies be they power or ecconomic ones push till you hit back...
so what would I do?
I'd say give them back to us now, stop or we will board you by force as you in contravention of a court order and entered our EEZ without permission!
The laws the law mate....
ps any goverment owned vessel that can shoot an explosive projectile is techincaly a warship... and when crewed by Goverment Security details, then what other definition do you have???
Tony Halliday: ~Meals on Reels ~
It takes a strong fish to swim against the current. Even a dead one can float with it
"It is always in season for old men to learn." Aeschylus (525-456 BC)
"In a mad world only the mad are sane." Akira Kurosawa (1910-1998)
WADRay
Posts: 301
Date Joined: 20/12/09
Im calling BS to you and your
Im calling BS to you and your garbage...Out of an australian report Shonan Maru no2 was docked in Freo Feb 2007. It was INVITED to join aussie vessels in SOWER research. Interesting for a vessel "wanted by the australians if it enters our EEZ" Also as clearly stated by our HEAD legal adviser they have no grounds for action... Do you really think they would come out and say that on national news if there was an existing court permit to take the vessel if it enters our waters? Surely you realise that lieing to the nation might be a bad pollitical move when even you can find proof, oh wait what proof?
search and read www.amsa.gov.au/shipping_safety you might find a few very interesting reports on there about our little research/security vessel (not armed thats why they send it for those that cant think outside their own prejudices)...
Oh and by the way did you realise steve irwin is a NAVAL VESSEL (Island class patrol vessel)flying a netherland flag? Oh no a naval vessel entered aussie waters we better board them and sieze their ship and rah rah rah rant rant rant dribble dribble dribble
Tony Halliday
Posts: 2500
Date Joined: 14/06/07
mate in 2009 full high court
mate in 2009 full high court said the order can be enforced, so call my BS a legal document: Humane Society International vs Kyodo Senpaku Kaisha ltd [2005]FCAFC116, WITH FINAL APPEAL: [2007] FCA 124, UPHELD 12 DEC 2007 BY Justice J Allsop....
now mate go tell three high court justices they BS sprouters as well.... as Shonan Maru no2 was in dock in Feb 2007 why appeal was ongoing and only could be siezed after final appeal uphelod in Dec 2007. ( ps get your facts right before you call people names mate...
)
After December 2007 no registered whaling ship has made port in Australia or inside controlled waters, due to warrants outstanding. In the advent of a emergancy crew transfer, the warrant would not be impossed under Martime Law as a course of right.
and yes the Steve Irwin is a decommisioned old warship, but it has no means of firing an explosive prohectile, where the Shonan Maru no2 can!
The deal done overnight will see the activists transfer take place outside of the EEZ I bet to safew guard the Japs from being served with warrant and siezure, and that will have been the deal the pollies did under the table last night....
So Sea Shephard comes out shinning having breached the Japs secruity ship and Roxon saves face getting them back to Australian mainland.
ps did you see the The Project report last night on channel 10 and the write ups in several East Coast news papers of the consequences of the Japs being well inside the EEz and on the boundary of the Terrorial waters??? Go look and see what the Legal Eagles are saying...
Tony Halliday: ~Meals on Reels ~
It takes a strong fish to swim against the current. Even a dead one can float with it
"It is always in season for old men to learn." Aeschylus (525-456 BC)
"In a mad world only the mad are sane." Akira Kurosawa (1910-1998)
Rod P
Posts: 725
Date Joined: 20/05/08
Once again for the record the
Once again for the record the Steve Irwin is stormed and raided ever year it returns from the Southern Ocean by Australian Customs.
The SM 2 ws in port in 2007. The court rulling was from 2008 actually. One of teh biggest problems the whalers have is there are banned from just about ever port outside Japan. they have limited access to some Asian counties but are banned in Aus, NZ, SA all the way down the coast.
The Steve Irwin is also registered as a Private vessel not a ship so struggle to see how its a government naval vessel.
Id say lets at least try and debate the facts, not rubbish.
UncutTriggerInWA
Posts: 2692
Date Joined: 05/09/08
Ha Ha
la la la la la
You need to be contacting Julia by phone mate. maybe she needs your expert advice.
So if they give them back as you say they should, what would we do with these radicals given their bad behaviour? Give them a medal and create anti-whaling terrorist schools in outback Pakistan?
As I discussed earlier, I have been listening very closely to the commentary from people I need to listen to because of their intimate knowledge of the law. As for the war ship issue we allow plenty to come here for R&R to spend big bucks and others to engage in military exercises. Maybe we just did an "exercise" with the Japanese LOL. This is all a scam to discredit the Sea Shepherd regime??? I think someone earlier asked the question about what would happen to these guys if the boarded a US navy ship unlawfully in Australian waters because they didn't agree with them bombing the crap out of nations who breed idiology and terrorism.
Vince.
Work smart and fish often.
Member and die-hard supporter of the mighty West Coast Eagles.
till
Posts: 9358
Date Joined: 21/02/08
The last Australian Prime
The last Australian Prime Minster to be hard on Japan was Curtin. The rest have been too busy maintaining trade relations to worry about whales, irrespective of which party they're from.
Tony Halliday
Posts: 2500
Date Joined: 14/06/07
Bet Bob Hawk or any of those
Bet Bob Hawk or any of those 1970's and 1980's PM's would have stuck it too them in the eye!
Tony Halliday: ~Meals on Reels ~
It takes a strong fish to swim against the current. Even a dead one can float with it
"It is always in season for old men to learn." Aeschylus (525-456 BC)
"In a mad world only the mad are sane." Akira Kurosawa (1910-1998)
till
Posts: 9358
Date Joined: 21/02/08
Everything was better in the
Everything was better in the old days, even Labor.
Tony Halliday
Posts: 2500
Date Joined: 14/06/07
in those days Labor was true
in those days Labor was true Labor by policy and not this wild cowboy bunch they now got! but lest save that for another thread...
Tony Halliday: ~Meals on Reels ~
It takes a strong fish to swim against the current. Even a dead one can float with it
"It is always in season for old men to learn." Aeschylus (525-456 BC)
"In a mad world only the mad are sane." Akira Kurosawa (1910-1998)
Shorty
Posts: 1549
Date Joined: 10/05/08
Just watched the video,,i
Just watched the video,,i thought it was a daring raid over razor wire and god knows what,,i only say a couple strands of barb wire,,
Anyway i am against whaling but the wars provide great entertainment in the interim,,i loved how the Japs run down the batmobile last year that was spectatcular,it was text book Pearl Harbour stuff they were not expecting it at all,,