hilux owners
ive spoken to a couple of toyota dealers about this, and thats a few hours of my life i want back....
ok, so im getting a brand new one for work, and toyota have bought the price of the new turbo diesels (3L) down to par with the V6 (4L) petrol. only thing is, the diesel auto is only a 4-speed, whereas the V6 petrol (which is what i have now), is a 5 speed auto.
i have always towed my big boat (about 1.5 tonne) in 4th, rather than 5th, as its better for the transmission/gearbox, and its better economics as it doesnt labour the engine/waste unburnt fuel during the lower rev range. it does this perfectly, and sits on 100kmph at around 2200 - 2300rpm. fuel useage is not much more than usual driving, and probably get about 15-20% less mileage when towing like this (compared to not towing).
my questions to any AUTOMATIC DIESEL hilux owners is this: do you tow in top (4th) gear, or do you drop it down to 3rd? if you do have to tow in 3rd, at what rev range is 100kmph? or, does the diesel's transmission allow for the better torque range at lower revs, and make it designed/acceptable to tow in 4th?
is all this making any sense?!? any feedback helpful.
cheers
nev
Posts: 193
Date Joined: 04/02/09
Top Gear
mate , I owned a 2008 Hilux and also a 2.2 tonne ally boat. Been to Carnarvon about 4 times now in it and allways in top cog (Auto). Its a pretty big boat so most of the time its not in overdrive. I now own a Prado diesel auto and I reckon the Hilux towed better with the 4 speed tranny. Had one issue though with the Hilux , tranny used to overheat occasionally and Toyota had to fit an additional oil cooler, free of charge.
jng
Posts: 488
Date Joined: 03/08/07
Hey Nev, was there much issue
Hey Nev, was there much issue getting the dealer to install a oil cooler. Which dealer are you with?
jng
Posts: 488
Date Joined: 03/08/07
I own a 2009 hilux t/d auto,
I own a 2009 hilux t/d auto, and have always towed in 4th gear. Boat weighs around 1900kg loaded up. The a/t temp dash light did come on the other day while towing to pinjarra.
Tomcat
Posts: 614
Date Joined: 24/02/11
Same
Towed my shark cat to exxy this year in my sons hilux auto . Trans light kept coming on the book says to tow in drive so I think there is a problem somewhere . Any feed back would be good
roberta
Posts: 2773
Date Joined: 08/07/08
We have two Toyota's
Our Hilux Ute, is a 1993 manual 5 gears, 2.8litre deisel and we always towed in 5th gear, sitting on the legal speed. Even when road temperature is over 30c we still towed in 5th and had a/c towing the one ton boat, no temperature worries. In the manual it says when towing it is adviseable to tow in 4th due to braking ONLY concerns. Nothing about towing in 4th for gearbox.
Our new Toyota Prado 6gear auto 3ltre turbo is fantastic with towing, up up and away. We've only towed the boat around the suburbs (for me to get used to towing with auto as always used to gears) The only intructions we had when buying new was, we weren't allowed to tow (even a trailer) for 800klms
Have asked several mechanic (well old fart has) and its a myth to tow in 4th gear, use your gears to which the ute is built for.
Ginger Tablets Rock
scotto
Posts: 2470
Date Joined: 21/04/08
not so sure
not so sure about that roberta....
a good few years ago, we used to use my mates 80 series petrol landcruiser to tow another mates 8m jackman (about 2.2 tonne, maybe 2.5 loaded).
after the 3rd trip, he put it in to get serviced and looked at, because the gearbox was making a funny noise. the mechanic went to change the gearbox oil, and it came out silver.... the 5th gear cog was almost completely destroyed - a direct result of towing too much weight on such a small gear (apparantly the 5th gear cog is only twice the girth of your thumb). it was an apparantly very common problem, and toyota improved on it with the 100 series, but still not good practice to tow in top gear in auto or manual, in any vehicle. it wasnt a cheap exercise to get replaced either.....
smash
Posts: 434
Date Joined: 01/12/10
wow
your 2.8 must be a rocket-both of mine struggled to do legal speed WITHOUT towing!
Seriously, great utes but-got a TD 2001 now.
The "towing in 5th" problem with the G52 box (2.8 lux) relates to 5th gear being on one side of the carrier plate on a blind shaft.
The V6 and TD boxes have a bearing supporting both sides of 5th.
My old one snapped the shaft clean off and 5th gear drops to the bottom of the box, as if it never existed. Apparently this is common as well as collapsing bearings which then rapidly take the gear itself with them.
roberta
Posts: 2773
Date Joined: 08/07/08
Smash
we still have the 93 hilux ute and just done 244,000 klms, it would still tow all the way to Leeman on 100klms with a/c, towing the 1 ton boat, 125litres of fuel, spare tyre, big esky in back with frozen bait/cray bait) with supplies and the back of the ute full of eskies with meat etc, old fart would have to get down to 3rd on some hills going to Leeman (Brand H'way) but the old girl still sits on 100klms towing the boat, loaded with all my crap as he calls it. He hasn't made his mind up whether he are selling it or keeping it, as I've bought the 2010 Prado as mentioned above, he's always towed in 5th gear and touch wood never had the gear box looked at, changes gears, no crunching, synro's all good. Certainly feels weird getting back into the old girl after driving the 3ltre turbo deisel, I get into trouble call the Hilux the slug bucket hahaha
Ginger Tablets Rock
Buz
Posts: 1555
Date Joined: 28/08/07
Wow thats out of this world
Wow thats out of this world that your 2.8 could do those speed towing.
I bought mine in 2003 with 150000km on it. I used to tow my tinnie loaded up(max 800kg roughly) in the N.T and would sit on 100km/h in 5th gear no dramas on the flat, used alot more fuel though. Any hills though, back down to 3rd and maybe 60km/h, and big long hills it was usually back down to 2nd and 30km/h.
Though when towing my 5.8m Ally that wieghs 1320kg unloaded i would max out at about 80km/h on the flat with no wind. Couldnt even attempt to get into 5th gear, except maybe down a slight decline. Often i would sit towing at about 70-75km/h in 4th, which was fine for getting from my place to the ramp as the metro speed limit never exceeded that on my route. Though sucked when moving it between Perth and Busso, which is why i usually left Perth at midnight to avoid any traffic. The new forest hwy made it easier being dual lane all the way till nearly Capel, so my slow arse could stay in the left lane. So usually kept it towing in 4th and have never had an issue with gearbox.
Now got a 3.0L TD hilux, but still only ever tow in 4th at 100km/h, putting it up to fifth gear just makes it feel like its struggling to much.
roberta
Posts: 2773
Date Joined: 08/07/08
Buz
the Hilux does what I've said and we get 21 miles to the gallon (old fart only works in gallons) towing the boat and wind factor, 24 miles to the gallon around town with or without a/c. From what a few of you have written here with the older hilux, think we must have got a gem. We bought it in 1998 came from Kununrra Mission and had 98,000klms on. We've always got a good service, hahah sounds like we better keep it in the family.
Buz, the old Hilux never felt like it was struggling, even going up a hill towing the boat, maybe because old fart was a heavy haulage truck driver and then semi's, B doubles and triples, I don't really know how we get such good towing capacitity and mileage in the old girl.
Ginger Tablets Rock
Buz
Posts: 1555
Date Joined: 28/08/07
I reckon you should definitly
I reckon you should definitly hold onto you Hilux if its that good!, They are great vehicles, easy to work on and repair if anything goes wrong, and there are thousands of them around oz, so spares are easy to come by even in the middle of nowhere.
I only upgraded mine because of the towing factor for my 5.8m boat. I guess my Hilux was like most and just a slug. But since being in a new TD model, i dont think i could ever go back to a naturally aspirated diesel. Love that acceleration and torque for towing and 4x4ing!
I tow in 4th at 100km/h (but prefer to sit on about 95km/h) with my TD hilux at about 2200rpm. The turbo only kicks in at about 2000rpm.
smash
Posts: 434
Date Joined: 01/12/10
which model Buz?
it was you that was asking about buying over east wasnt it? I bought a 2001 TD, goes pretty good and is still a knock around ute+ legal for my 5.8 to tow.
Buz
Posts: 1555
Date Joined: 28/08/07
Hi smash, yeah mate i did end
Hi smash, yeah mate i did end up buying a 2002 3.0L TD from over East. Got in in Adelaide and drove back in a couple of days accross the nullaBORE. Totally legal to tow boat now with a braked rating of 1800kg. So even with my 1320kg boat loaded with a bit of extra gear it will still be way under.
Not like my old 2.8L which was only rated to 1500kg braked. Actually just sold the 2.8L today, so end of eight great years with my 2.8L and the beginning of a new era with the 3.0L TD
smash
Posts: 434
Date Joined: 01/12/10
ha!
you went down exactly the same path as I did, got an 01TD.
One thing with the 1KZ motors in these utes-beware of overheating it. The alloy heads are easily cracked.
I got an Engine Guardian off Ebay for $120 which will tell you exactly the temp, really easy to fit. The stock gauges have a flat spot and arent much good til too late.
good luck with it all!
Buz
Posts: 1555
Date Joined: 28/08/07
Yeah read about that problem
Yeah read about that problem on a 4x4 forum so have already bought an engine guardian too off ebay. Did you by you by the overseas one, or the australian one that comes with a cigarette lighter socket, but you just cut it off to hardwire it? Havent fitted mine in just yet.
smash
Posts: 434
Date Joined: 01/12/10
I bought the Engine Watchdog
I bought the Engine Watchdog (Aus one) but the display was really clumsy (size and shape of a cigarette packet) and it was difficult to mount in my Landcruiser neatly. The digits packed up on it so I got it refunded and bought the Engine Guardian. Neat little display, same sensor and a bit cheaper. Got one for each car.
I hardwired them, just used the back of the cigarette lighter terminals, and mounted the display below the ashtray.
Buz
Posts: 1555
Date Joined: 28/08/07
Nice one, will be hardwoiring
Nice one, will be hardwoiring mine up when i can get motivated too.
Eventually i am looking at putting a 3in free flow exhaust system and get a set of gauges(boost and EGT) to keep an eye on things. This may all lead to eventually putting a powerchip of some sort in, but that might be a couple of years off still.
roberta
Posts: 2773
Date Joined: 08/07/08
So true Buz
old fart I think will keep the old girl, as he can fix most things on her, hates driving our new TD Prado, reckons if it stops, call the road side assistance hahahah computers on them they stuff up thats it. But being a woman I wanted a bit more comfort for my old age, 6 speed auto and geezes it goes, the kick down on the auto feels like a V8 when it kicks down. Love the extra speed especially for a deisel. Really have to watch myself on country roads, glad its got cruise control hahahah
Ginger Tablets Rock
Paul_86
Posts: 1449
Date Joined: 27/03/09
Im no mechanic and dont have
Im no mechanic and dont have a hilux but if ur cars a turbo deisel and your towning in 4th gear at 100km's then wouldnt your revs be up around the high 2000's? If thats the case then id be more worried about the rediculous amount of fuel ud be useing and your car overheating from your turbo spooling up for so long? Just a thought?!
scotto
Posts: 2470
Date Joined: 21/04/08
No no no,
Just test drove the new TD today. Sits on 1800rpm in 4th doin 100kmph, 2000rpm at 110kmph in 4th, and 2200 -2300rpm doin 100kmph in 3rd.
Even in my current 4L petrol, towing a 1.5+ tone boat in 4th, rpm is under 2500 at 100kmph, which is more than an acceptable fuel usage for towing.
Paul_86
Posts: 1449
Date Joined: 27/03/09
Ah ok, yeah well then with
Ah ok, yeah well then with those revs u would be fine with ur fuel, i was just comparing to my 3lt turbo deisel. 5th 100k/h and 2000 rpm and good milage but go up to 110k/h and ur at 2300 and almost double the fuel consumption when towing that is.
Buz
Posts: 1555
Date Joined: 28/08/07
Most Turbo diesels are happy
Most Turbo diesels are happy to sit at between 2000-2500rpm with most haveing their turbos only kick in at 1800-2000rpm. You can tune your turbo with powerchips and the like to have the turbo kick in a lower revs. My mates L/Cruiser 4.2TD with Steinbauer chip, turbo kicks in at 1400rpm. HEAPS of low down power right where you want it when towing with a diesel!
Even some of the newer TD's, eg VW Amarok sit happy at 3000-3500rpm. All depends on the engine i guess.
Cammos
Posts: 606
Date Joined: 30/06/09
So by the sounds of all this
So by the sounds of all this I should reconsider towing my 2t boat in 6th gear in my TD Navara? It revs at about 2100rpm at 100km/h.
Buz
Posts: 1555
Date Joined: 28/08/07
Every car brand is different
Every car brand is different mate, what gear to tow in a 60 series cruiser, or TD navara will be completely different. Alot of the newer modern cars gearing is designed so that you can tow in the top gears. It all comes down to asking your mechanic(if he is in the know and you trust him) or contact the actaul car manufacturers to ask what they recommend. But from the revs you have said you are getting in 6th, i would say there doesnt seem to be a unreal amount or strain being put on your gearbox. But like i said, dont take my word for it, or anyone else who says 'well i do it in mine and have had no problems' find out from the experts for your exact car.