Just how inefficient is the government?

 https://thewest.com.au/news/wa/wa-boaties-to-be-hit-by-fee-increases-in-the-thousands-of-dollars-as-part-of-governments-harbour-plan-ng-b88861141z

After 8 years with a trailer boat, we bought a boat needing a pen.  Fees are currently over $8k.. + GST.

According to this, fees are set to increase by 10% plus inflation every year until they have more than doubled.

Fairly sure private organisations don't need nearly $20k per year to cover their costs providing a pen and power. Does anyone use a non-government mooring? - If so, how much for a 12m boat and do you have any spaces?!

Thanks! 


Walfootrot's picture

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Date Joined: 23/07/12

Try the sailing clubs, glad I

Mon, 2018-06-11 10:32

Try the sailing clubs, glad I have a mooring, but looks like they will hit them up too

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More drum lines, kill the bloody sharks!

Dale's picture

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Date Joined: 13/09/05

Mon, 2018-06-11 13:57

 I don’t think it will effect the sailing clubs.

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"Just because you are a Character, Doesn't mean you have Character."

Mr Wolf

 

 

Alan James's picture

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Date Joined: 30/06/09

...

Mon, 2018-06-11 11:13

I note the Depatment of Transport is saying the user pays system needs to be adopted and I am generally agreeable with this approach.  However without trying to hijack this thread I'd like to know how cyclists contribute to the millions of dollars spent on cycle paths. 

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 I think you will find that

Mon, 2018-06-11 15:47

 I think you will find that nearly all,the cyclists that motorists complain about are adults and actually pay car registration fees as well. 1 person on a bike riding to work is another car off the road not getting in your way, you should be happy.

For the record I am a cyclist, and also pay 3 vehicle and 2 trailer registrations. None of those vehicles are on the road when I'm using the cycle path.

Jackfrost80's picture

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Try launching NoR and paying

Mon, 2018-06-11 21:42

Try launching NoR and paying near $10/day whilst all the other taxpayer funded ramps in WA are free

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If catching wrasse is cool, consider me Miles Davis

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 Yep, did that for 8 years

Mon, 2018-06-11 22:34

 Yep, did that for 8 years before getting the pen!

Escape's picture

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Date Joined: 14/12/11

DOT extortion

Mon, 2018-06-11 11:44

 Hi everybody,

Glad to see this topic getting a few legs - 

Declaration time - I am President of Hillarys Boat Harbour Penholders Association all of the DOT pens not the Yacht club side.

I have writtent to DoT and Minister for Transport Rita Saffiotti over the grab for cash whilst the facilities start to collapse around us.

Minister,

 
On behalf of the Hillarys Boat Harbour Pen Holders
Association (HBHPHA) may I say we are absolutely gobsmacked by the
magnitude of recently announced fee increases for 2018 - 2019 and beyond. Not only are these
fee increases out of step with the economy and reality, the compounding effect
will have long lasting implications.
 
The reasons stated are that currently marine facilities are only recovering approximately 50% of costs incurred. I would argue that the DOT is therefore excessively top heavy in management as other facilities run privately generate surpluses and maintain facilities whilst charging less for facilities than WA State Government. (We may own boats - it does not make us cash cows.) If we had a choice and could park these boats in our front yards we would.

 

Some years ago Pen holders accepted extraordinarily large pen fee increases having been promised that this would enable pen refurbishment
to be accelerated in the Hillarys Marina. (My understanding is that at one
point Hillarys was self sufficient and now is obviously treated as a cash cow).
Subsequent to this, the surpluses held within Hillarys for this purpose were
then dragged into consolidated revenue to the disadvantage of Hillarys Pen Holders who effectively subsidized other coastal facilities. Hillarys Marina is, as a consequence rapidly falling into a state of disrepair.

We now find a situation where the state of disrepair of Hillarys assets is such that:

 

  • Jetties and fingers are breaking away from their mountings.
  • Promised upgrades are delayed by years.
  • Pen holders are restricted in how jetties can be used because of load bearing concerns.
  • The delay in upgrades is costing  far more than it should because remedial works are constantly required and an ongoing
    process even on jetties due to be replaced - a situation that is utterly ridiculous, inefficient and a waste of funds. Repairs being conducted are patch up jobs of a sub standard nature with potential to cause damage to boats.
  • Additional promises of upgraded security and CCTV lack any substance whatsoever - either it doesn't work, doesn't communicate or is of a completely second rate standard. (Some would argue that we have been lied to as to the state of CCTV in the harbour).
  • Customer service standards - the will and want to provide a service to members and pen holders is deteriorating at a rapid
    rate. A situation of policing and inflexibility rather than communication
    is now evident. Pen holders perceive we are a nuisance and not a customer
    of DOT. Surely with this price gouging we must be customers and expect a
    standard of customer service.
  • Why should Hillarys or Fremantle (by way of example)
    pay for a regional facility installed as part of a political process?
  • I could go on with a list that is getting longer by the
    day.

Minister the behavior, service standards and price gouging by DOT Marine is unacceptable and simply not good enough - Pen Holders deserve far better as do families and the general public.

Pen holders and members are disgusted with this latest communication. Minister you can and should revise this price gouging immediately.
Your departments mention of reducing the "administration charge" for quarterly
payments does not go far enough. At best an administration charge of around 1-2
% is generally all that is allowed or acceptable. This should include a monthly
option at no further disadvantage to pen holders rather than the current 6 month or quarterly penalty situation.

 

 I could go on but am spending far to much time attempting to
pacify a mob of very angry pen holders.

 

Your customers deserve much much better than this.

 

I look forward to your response so I may inform members of
your actions.

 


Kind regards

Evan MacRae
 
President Hillarys Boat Harbour Pen Holders Association

 

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ROUGH RED

One day I hope to replace the boat picture I am using with one of a decent fish...One day...

Escape's picture

Posts: 70

Date Joined: 14/12/11

Latest update

Wed, 2018-06-13 09:56

 Multiple meetings scheduled with DoT and Members of Parliament along with a plan of further protest to be developed tonight.

I have asked DoT to specifically look into this example of gouging:

A pen holder with a 15m pen if choosing to pay quarterly is requested to pay an administration fee of $886.00 or 9.4% of the annual fee

A pen holder in the same pen choosing to pay monthly is hit with an administration fee of 80% or $7512.00 over and above the annual fee.

Does anybody think that is fair and reasonable?

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ROUGH RED

One day I hope to replace the boat picture I am using with one of a decent fish...One day...

Darren253's picture

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Date Joined: 23/07/16

I've seen the same for

Wed, 2018-06-13 11:25

I've seen the same for trailer registration recently...

3months rego was 60% of the cost of annual rego. Talk about ripping into those who can't afford to pay the full 12months in one go.

Posts: 10

Date Joined: 07/02/16

"User pays" is fine if it

Mon, 2018-06-11 11:50

"User pays" is fine if it means that the user is paying a fair rate.  For example, this used to mean that Hillarys Boat Harbour ran a surplus to reinvest in maintenance.  Then it all went into a central pot and mysteriously vanished!

After only a short time, Hillarys maintenance is now so behind that some jetties are deemed 'unsafe' and costs allegedly need to double. 
So the "users" would like to know who is is paying for what - and where?  For what it's worth, the staff at Hillarys Boat Harbour are great.  This is a higher-level move and it smells.

The other part of the original question was - "what are boaties paying for none-government marinas?".  In other words, is this doubling the cost bringing it to reflect the market rate, or are the boaties getting ripped off - can anyone share their costs, so that we can understand if this is ressonable or not?

scubafish's picture

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NO REPLY

Mon, 2018-06-11 12:01

E/Mail sent:

ATT: Mark McGowan MLA
I voted Labour all my life
Dear Mark,
Is the $5.00 increase in fees (lic) paying for the shark problem, because if it is" I will extremely Peed off "as the bloody surfers do not pay for lic and the beach fish'os don’t pay for lic?
Just the boaters, plus the extra fuel costs bait costs gear costs and not to mention the" cost of all the emergency equipment”, have you price the emergency kill switch for the boat as a solo fisher in a boat, it’s a disgrace for a piece of emg equipment solely use for safety to me. Don’t come back with the bull@##@ that it’s a small price to pay.
Gave up cray pots as sick of replacing pots that where stolen, so no more revenue from lic from me for that.
WHY does everything seem to be chancing the tourist $$$$?
What about us locals?
Born and bred in W.A.3rd gen
Unable to work due to health living off my super until it runs out then god knows.
No Gov hand outs for me.

NO REPLY!!

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z00m's picture

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Date Joined: 10/05/14

HYC

Mon, 2018-06-11 12:03

 When I looked into HYC costs for a pen a few years back it was about $2k more than the equivalent DOT pen. Plus you then had yacht club memberships on top of that. Mindarie is cheaper than Hillarys and not a DOT site so maybe check there? 12m pen was $6600 a year a couple of years ago. Not sure now.

Posts: 114

Date Joined: 14/11/10

HYC

Mon, 2018-06-11 12:41

Mate, it sounds as though you're describing the HYC!?!

Just paid annual pen (and Club) fees - total, just shy of $9000 for a 12m pen?!??!

And the infrastructure is falling apart.

Posts: 10

Date Joined: 07/02/16

Hi Septimus,So the

Mon, 2018-06-11 12:48

Hi Septimus,

So the infrastructure is the same, but at least they're not threatening you with another $10k / year!

Do you know whether there are pens available?  I used to be an HYC member, but the waiting list for pens was so many years long that they closed the list..

Posts: 114

Date Joined: 14/11/10

NAIVE

Mon, 2018-06-11 17:30

You'd have to be very naive to believe that this escalation of charges by DOT will not flow through to yacht club pen holders!!

I have heard that the situation regarding pens is nowhere near as tight as it has been in the past - wonder why - hahaha??

Posts: 478

Date Joined: 21/05/12

 mmm lets thank god we dont

Mon, 2018-06-11 15:55

 mmm lets thank god we dont get the amount of governing we r paying for 

a mate of mine - he s jewish said to me a long time ago 

he prefers unorganised, inefficient governments, the well organised governments tend to put people like him ( and free thinkers) in "exclusive housing"

i took his point :p

 

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Date Joined: 11/05/12

Port Geo

Mon, 2018-06-11 16:05

 The yearly fee for a pen in Port Geographe for a 15mt pen was $6234.00 inc gst this year

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He fishes, He fishes, He fishes, its the only thing in life. All he ever gets is hell from his fed up wife

Swompa's picture

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 Who voted for these flogs? 

Mon, 2018-06-11 19:18

 Who voted for these flogs? 

Alan James's picture

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Date Joined: 30/06/09

A government that advocates

Mon, 2018-06-11 19:33

taking from Peter to give to Paul will always get the support of Paul.  Clearly there are too many Pauls.

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Swompa's picture

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Can’t help but laugh at that

Tue, 2018-06-12 07:50

Can’t help but laugh at that as my name is Paul.

 

Escape's picture

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Date Joined: 14/12/11

Community Facebook site launched Stop DOT Marine Fee Increases

Thu, 2018-06-14 09:19

 Hi everyone,

If you are concerned about fee increases for your boat - moorings, registration, pens, boat ramps this is your chance to be heard in a more public forum.

All civil and constructive comments very welcome. https://www.facebook.com/groups/StopDOTMarineFeeIncrease/

Cheers 

Evan

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ROUGH RED

One day I hope to replace the boat picture I am using with one of a decent fish...One day...

richie68's picture

Posts: 69

Date Joined: 07/08/11

Pen Fees

Fri, 2018-06-15 15:31

 

As a member of Cockburn Power Boats Association, I would like to share that the Club has 12 metre floating pens available for $6,000 pa. Close to some of the best fishing in the metro area. Great facilities. Anyone interested should contact John at CPBA on 94185868.

Escape's picture

Posts: 70

Date Joined: 14/12/11

 That’s not bad at all for a

Sun, 2018-06-17 09:48

 That’s not bad at all for a 12 m floating pen. Pity I am NoR.

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ROUGH RED

One day I hope to replace the boat picture I am using with one of a decent fish...One day...

Posts: 1

Date Joined: 17/06/18

Pen $$ Food For Thought

Mon, 2018-06-18 08:54

per DOT "10% + CPI for 7 years"
HILLARYS DOT BOAT PEN
Pen Fee pa
FACT Apr-11 $5,248
Apr-12 $5,406
Apr-13 $5,947
Apr-14 $6,541
Apr-15 $7,054
Apr-16 $8,033
Apr-17 $8,233
Apr-18 $8,430 -this is already +61% since 2011!!

FORECAST Apr-19 $9,526 -assumes +10% plus cpi per DOT
Apr-20 $10,764
Apr-21 $12,164
Apr-22 $13,745
Apr-23 $15,532
Apr-24 $17,551
Apr-25 $19,832
Total $154,006
THIS IS OBVIOUSLY NOT SUSTAINABLE !!!!!!!!!!

(AND STOP CALLING ME SHURLEY)

Escape's picture

Posts: 70

Date Joined: 14/12/11

Pen $ Food for thought and the compounding effect

Mon, 2018-06-18 09:23

 BBB

 

Couldnt have said it any better - you are spot on. Talking with other pen holders I am convinced they have not looked at it this way - and the shock will really hurt.

 

Can I suggest you copy and paste your message also into the Facebook site Stop DOT Marine FEE Increase. You will probably need to ask to join but that will only take a moment.

Cheers Evan

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ROUGH RED

One day I hope to replace the boat picture I am using with one of a decent fish...One day...

Posts: 111

Date Joined: 25/09/08

Pen Fee's & Marina

Mon, 2018-06-18 18:51

 I have read through these coments & I can see why many of you people are totaly p155ed off.But please do not forget The Joondalup Shire want the State governmnet to help with the costs of building the bigger /more commercial shops & resturants at Ocean reef marina as they have seen what a cash cow the Hillarys Marina has been built for the Northern Suburbs boaties both trailer & Pen but now run with the view of commercial bussinises In Perth we have Two Rocks,been there for donkeys not big enough ,no parking Then Mindarrie quite a good set up Ocean Reef No real commercial opertunities No money to the Shire through rates Then Hillarys ,Outdated due to Perth's polulation explossion with cars commpeting with boat trailers for parking.

Escape's picture

Posts: 70

Date Joined: 14/12/11

Pen fees and Tourism no more holiday at home

Mon, 2018-07-30 14:37

 Hi everybody,

 

Had an interesting conversation today.

WA State Government and Tourism WA wants us to holiday at home.

Boaties would usually be in total agreement with this.

The more the Pen fees go up, the less we have to spend, the less we are likely to use the boat and visit tourist spots and spend money we no longer have.

DoT perhaps you should have a chat with one of your other Government Departments.

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ROUGH RED

One day I hope to replace the boat picture I am using with one of a decent fish...One day...