Dead pinks 2
Submitted by little johnny on Fri, 2015-11-20 19:01
Washing up on shore now in front of my work. Just took this then. There gills look burnt. This one not that long dead. Thought it was seal. More washing up. This is not looking good for stocks at all. A good 12 plus kilo female in picture
sea-kem
Posts: 15039
Date Joined: 30/11/09
Sounds like some dickhead
Sounds like some dickhead opened the wrong valve at any one of those major industries in the sound there and let out whatever. Be hard pressed to prove who I guess but you can only hope. What a disgrace.
Love the West!
Griffo84
Posts: 118
Date Joined: 28/05/10
This is just horrible. If it
This is just horrible. If it is pollution the company/organisation involved is in deep shit. May be a good idea for fisheries to close fishing in the sound for a season or 2?
Do the right thing and there will be fish tomorrow.
Jason P
Posts: 521
Date Joined: 16/02/13
Latest Update from Fisheries
Latest update
www.fish.wa.gov.au/About-Us/Media-releases/Pages/Fisheries-update-on-Cockburn-Sound-fish-deaths.aspx
DM306
choc
Posts: 670
Date Joined: 05/01/12
I hope they are putting
I hope they are putting signs up at the boatramps and beach fishing spots to warn people not to consume anything from the area.
Moking
Posts: 1252
Date Joined: 30/05/12
temporarily not to collect or
My Dad taught me how to Fish-Thanks Dad.(RIP)
little johnny
Posts: 5362
Date Joined: 04/12/11
Interesting one
Today fisheries had meeting with navy. Apparently big school gone belly up again. Over a thousand snapper gone? Over last few days washed up on island. ??They swam in not looking healthy. Then all gone( dead). Second hand info unsure. What a shame still dying.. Once again to little to late. All bans fisheries put in place to protect fish. Gone in week. Stocks where looking fantastic. Then done good job. Must be very toxic to effect outside off big bridge( coat hanger). Crying shame I wonder if anyone will find out what's done it??
Moking
Posts: 1252
Date Joined: 30/05/12
The Daily Mail UK seems to
The Daily Mail UK seems to have a lots of info and pic's:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3329284/Locals-left-bewildered-700-dead-fish-discovered-washed-popular-tourist-beach-Western-Australia.html
My Dad taught me how to Fish-Thanks Dad.(RIP)
Notorious
Posts: 914
Date Joined: 23/02/12
to quote a bloke on our
to quote a bloke on our closed forums: "The Navy have been doing radiation testing on the subs in port at garden island last week (testing for cracks I think) may or may not have some thing to do with it... Seems a little suss that dead fish start floating around in the area a few a day later though."
https://www.facebook.com/groups/174055815943047/?fref=nf
lachieH
Posts: 1126
Date Joined: 02/03/13
Gills seem burnt -
Gills seem burnt - radiation. Also that would explain why it has been covered up...
Fishing the swan for bream, it's just an obsession
Madmerv
Posts: 672
Date Joined: 24/01/15
Radiation testing
Been involved i a fair bit of radiation testing over the years and i can tell you it would not be affecting the fish. Very low level radiation, just enough for the tools to pick up if there is a crack in a weld or steel pipe.
The radiation might have an area radius of a foot or two so wont burn anything other than a barnicle.
That said i wouldnt rule out something else from the navy.
Sometimes when the water is quiet, you can hear the fish laughing at you !
meglodon
Posts: 5981
Date Joined: 17/06/10
This is bloody outrageous
All the good work to promote and foster growth of the largest known pink snapper breeding mass in the lower west coast appears now to have been decimated.
It's bloody outrageous that such a thing has happened, if this is man caused then those responsible must be severally punished.
No slap on the hand stuff and a bit of tut tut what bad luck.
There are no such things as accidents, only events caused by circumstances which have been allowed to happen or gone unchecked.
Good example look at the Varanus Island gas outage, (love that word," outage" stuff up and lack of maintenance).
If a fisherman takes one just one snapper during the closed season he would be hung drawn and quartered by DoF if this catastrophe has been caused by industry , defence or any other human activity then they should be shut down forthwith, immediately, until they can prove that it is safe for them to resume business again.
They should be fined such an amount that their share price will not worth the paper the shares are written on, and made to pay for a stock replenishment programme to rebuild the bio mass.
If it's an arm of government same same no let off.
Am I angry you bet I am, and so should every member of this site. Make you anger known to your local council and state MP as well as your federal member, let them know that if their actions to punish those responsible are not to your satisfaction you will actively support/help any person who opposes them when they next come up for election.
If the cause is an "act of nature" then we should ask DoF via it's minister to seek funds of a size needed to undertake an extensive stock breading programme to assist in getting the bio mass back to sustainable size.
There was a post on this site about what do we do when we don't agree with something, I for one didn't agree with a lot of what was written, I don't feel like a hypocrite when I say that all F/W members should make their displeasure (if man caused) or desire to see these iconic fish protected vigorously.
Sorry for the long post, however I feel very emotional about the loss.
Jason P
Posts: 521
Date Joined: 16/02/13
If the Navy is involved in
If the Navy is involved in this, I'm sure it will be a big cover up.
DM306
out wide
Posts: 1535
Date Joined: 30/12/08
Yep i'll have a bet on the
Yep i'll have a bet on the navy..this is more that a dose of polution from the industrial area. You wouldn't want to swim dive anywhere within cooee of this shit. Hope it doesn't get out to the crays.
little johnny
Posts: 5362
Date Joined: 04/12/11
Well it's hit collie ledge
And my dive spot. West side of coat hanger. Such a big volume of fresh salt water there? The ones washing up in front of my work 1 and 2s. Only on South wester. It not disease .oxygen issue or pollution in my opinion . It hit hard and fast. Feel for guys who depend on sound for income also. It's costing fisheries 500 bucks a fish to test( older dead ones) that's why they need ones still kicking must be cheaper I gather . There doing everything they can. I would like to know how many have been picked up in navy waters . I think the public have the right to know. People who have chased pinks for fair few generations know with big boys go to spawn . Well before causeway was there massive schools would shelter and breed in huge numbers where small boats compound is . Also some goods reads when navy use to clean there hulls and catch huge numbers of snapper feeding on barnacles . Many many generations of pinks always have gone there. I would have to say it's the most pinks I have ever seen this year spawning in sound. There number have increased dramatically .. I think it would be in the thousands( dead ones) we will never know. Not counting the billions of eggs. I don't know who is responsible . Would be nice to know the truth. To make sure it never happens again. Waiting game
little johnny
Posts: 5362
Date Joined: 04/12/11
Will this effect
Desalination plant??
sandbar
Posts: 704
Date Joined: 25/10/09
desal plant
could of come from the desal plant, lots of good water goes in and the rest after treating comes out! Into cockburn sound?
Ships Ballast?
TorquenFish
Posts: 321
Date Joined: 30/12/12
Desal has sweet feck all
Desal has sweet feck all impact at their outfall points. Done a lot of enviro water quality monitoring around the Cape Preston Citic Pacific outfall and all accute effects are back to ambient conditions with 50m. Even the slight variation in water quailty at the outfall point in miniscule. Nothing to harm fish that's for sure.
Jaggo
Posts: 206
Date Joined: 06/05/14
I don't know much about
I don't know much about Cockburn Sound, but my guess is that this has caused a pretty big dent in the Snapper stocks in there. 700 fish is around 4 ton of Snapper, 1000 fish is 5 or 6 ton of Snapper. That's a huge amount of fish for that area. All the hard work done by fisheries, recs and commercials with closures etc undone within a few days. It's worse than if a trawler got in there and trawled up 6 ton. All these magnificent fish have gone to waste.
Walfootrot
Posts: 1385
Date Joined: 23/07/12
Wonder if they have shutdown
Wonder if they have shutdown the desalination plant. If this is a chemical spill then they will be processing contaminated water
More drum lines, kill the bloody sharks!
Auslobster
Posts: 1901
Date Joined: 03/05/08
Not just adult snapper...
...under natural conditions, something like 95% of those eggs/larvae will not make it to maturity. With what's happened now, you can pretty much bank on 100% mortality rate. As little jonny says, bad result for GENERATIONS of pink snapper. Not to mention the effect on seagrass beds and the entire food chain, which no doubt is a huge reason why the snapper come to spawn there in the first place.
Howard George
Posts: 544
Date Joined: 10/03/11
Cover up.
Unless there is an independent analysis done you can almost guarantee there will be a cover-up if the desal plant is involved.
lachieH
Posts: 1126
Date Joined: 02/03/13
So we have discussed why
So we have discussed why this has happened, and I'm sure no one wants to think about this but what will the fishing be like in the future? Will it end up like just a nice place to be?
Fishing the swan for bream, it's just an obsession
Swompa
Posts: 3910
Date Joined: 14/10/12
We have extensively
We have extensively speculated on what the cause has been though without knowing a FACT, this is purely speculation.
The photos seem to show the membrane between the cartridge on the fish dorsal fins/tails has dissolved so what, acidification or chemical burns?
It would be very concerning to find out that the Desal plant is still in operation knowing that there is clearly a biological incident in the sound.
meglodon
Posts: 5981
Date Joined: 17/06/10
What does the desal plant discharge.
This is pure speculation ok, what happens to the salt that is extracted from the salt water that comes into the desal plant, is this then discharged back into the sound as super salt content water.
Now that would be a toxic bomb that would be hard to detect.
The case against such a thing happening is of course, why has this not happened before and I'm sure that there would be safe guards against such adverse actions like that happening. Wouldn't there, hey we are talking about a government body here just like the Water corp, and government corporations don't make huge mistakes that's why the heads of these bodies are paid good salaries.
As I have said in my previous post, I don't give a rats who has cause this (if indeed it is human caused) their bloody heads should be put on a plate and served up to the public to view.
Swompa
Posts: 3910
Date Joined: 14/10/12
I wholeheartedly agree that
I wholeheartedly agree that heads should roll
Some of the suggestions I have read on this case are:
Navy doing radiation testing (Possible but unlikely as the radiation is so small)
Nuclear Submarine (unlikely)
Grain spill from CBH (with Photos) (Possible but unlikely as it was floating?)
Tiwest were found guilty by a bloke on Facebook (Possible)
Ballast Dump from a ship (Possible)
Duckshit drains flowing (Unlikely to kill 1000+ fish in such a large body of water
Alcoa (Possible as the shit they pump into the ships is pretty nasty if you inhale it)
Death due to copious copulating (unlikely as this hasn't been seen before
and the Desal Plant (big salt dump? possible?)
The fact that there are deeper water and bottom dwelling species are being killed rather than upper colum/surface dwelling species (birds) could show that whatever is doing this is substance heavier than the water it is in and sinks....
I still find it amazing that no sharks have washed up yet considering there seems to be a fair few in the sound.
DTrain
Posts: 486
Date Joined: 10/02/12
Radiation doesn't travel very
Radiation doesn't travel very far through water. Even if they had a very powerful radiation source it would be cut down to nothing after a couple of meters.
Pink Snapper live and breed in Shark Bay which is 1.5 to 2 times more salty than the ocean. So shouldn't be affected by extra salt from the desal plant. The water temperatures in Shark Bay are also much higher than the sound so even if there were some high water temps it shouldn't affect the Snapper.
A disease seems unlikely due to lots of different species being affected.
The guy from the mussel farm was on the radio this morning saying that he was getting some tests done for a type of algae that can grow on the gills of fish causing them to suffocate. So that's possible if there was a sudden bloom of it.
The pictures appear to show burn marks around the gills so I'm thinking some kind of chemical burn but not sure.
TorquenFish
Posts: 321
Date Joined: 30/12/12
See my post above. Desal has
See my post above. Desal has almost no effect on surrounding wildlife in 99% of cases.
Howard George
Posts: 544
Date Joined: 10/03/11
Binninup Desal Plant.
I attended a public meeting when the Binninup desal plant was in the planning stage and one of the major concerns was the heavy salt brine that was released lay on the ocean floor and caused oxygen depletion. Theres a few alarm bells ringing for me.
Auslobster
Posts: 1901
Date Joined: 03/05/08
Not THAT amazing...
...there has never been any trace of cancer detected in sharks. Different physiology from true (boney) fish, and could quite likely be able to endure lower water quality.
To the above comment regarding excess salt content being difficult to detect: checking salinity levels is probably the EASIEST test to perform.
As I mentioned before, the creatures that live and feed in the upper part of the water column appear to be unaffected. Benthic species, ie urchins, crays, blowies, wrasse, etc...as well as the higher life forms that feed on them(snapper) are the ones copping the brunt of it. Tells me if it IS poison/pollution, would be of the heavy, sinking variety.
Also worth noting that the latter part of last week featured strong offshore winds in the mornings. Which would indicate less Navy and more Kwinana Industry as a possible source.
Justin M
Posts: 1207
Date Joined: 14/01/13
Cancer has been detected in
Cancer has been detected in sharks previously, a researcher by the name of Dr Ostrander had several specimens that had multiple malignant tumours also amongst other cartilagenous fish. This was back in 2004.
Broome lad
Posts: 191
Date Joined: 16/11/15
Navy
I'm only new down here and put the first report on here about the dead fish after seen the floating near garden island and am shocked at all the possible causes , I spoke with a mate who's son works on garden island and is a very keen free diver and fisho he gets the feeling over there that something is not right and the the navy could have something to do with it , and on the day I first saw the fish the navy ribs where scooting about the sound and came to shoo me away for been to close to the jetty when I said I was just looking at all the dead fish the told me to just get out of there . Hope we get some answers soon as there were people fishing an swimming there for days until anything was said .i also contacted fisheries that day and recfishwest who are the only people tha showed any immediate concern and responded to my email directly .
bommer
Posts: 10
Date Joined: 20/07/13
If you were near the jetty
If you were near the jetty on garden island then being told to move is nothing out of the ordinary as it is navy waters and the ribs will tell you to leave any day of the week
Swompa
Posts: 3910
Date Joined: 14/10/12
Largely edited as I was
Largely edited as I was wrong.
According to Navionics, the discharge pipe from the Cockburn Desal plant ends in 8m of water.
sea-kem
Posts: 15039
Date Joined: 30/11/09
All pure speculation guys.
All pure speculation guys. No reason to point any finger until testing results are released. If the desal plant was the culprit there would have been dead fish before now as the plant has been running a few years.
Love the West!
Michael Yoni
Posts: 604
Date Joined: 02/01/11
"Sounds like some dickhead
"Sounds like some dickhead opened the wrong valve at any one of those major industries in the sound there and let out whatever. Be hard pressed to prove who I guess but you can only hope. What a disgrace. "... So how long have you suffered from PE.
sea-kem
Posts: 15039
Date Joined: 30/11/09
Was that a rhetorical
Was that a rhetorical question? If so, what's your point?
Love the West!
Willlo
Posts: 1490
Date Joined: 07/10/11
Pull your head in mate,yr
Pull your head in mate,yr getting a bit tedious with the personal stuff.
Call Sign - BZ785
Haynes Hunter Prowler CC
420casts
Posts: 281
Date Joined: 25/03/13
Pollution
What is the likelyhood of something really volatile being spilt from ships in the area ?
As far as the Desalination Plant theory, do fish's gills burn from too much salt in the water ? It would make some sense in my mind with the pipe being that lowin the water column.
The abovementioned mussel farm man on the radio testing for algae also sounds like it could be possible. I'm still tending to think deep down its Kwinana industry.
My YouTube channel, Fishing Rigs & How To's and more:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCr9kJWJYyoaOkHRDu1pxszg
@666percentfishing
TorquenFish
Posts: 321
Date Joined: 30/12/12
Hypersaline water won't burn
Hypersaline water won't burn like those photos and the water coming out of the desal isn't hypersaline plus it difuses into ambient levels so rapidly you can barely pick it. Effects in water quality may include; small increase in conductivity/salinity (a few ms/l), slight rise in temperature (up to a degree or two within a ~20-50m radious), slight drop in dissolved oxygen (this can vary by around 10% DO saturation but ambient DO % sat varies by far more than this due to natural factors such as tide, swell, wind chop, sediment in water (total suspended sediment / NTU) and PAR (photosynthetic available radiation - ie. what can be used by plants to grow). Long story short, I'd be looking for another culprit.
FYI - I'd like to find out why this happened as much as the next bloke, just mindful of spreading malicious missinformation about innocent parties. I'm not desal expert by any means but I work as a marine scientist doing a lot of enviro monitoring for dredge and desal projects so just passing on the figures and facts I see on the regular.
Swompa
Posts: 3910
Date Joined: 14/10/12
Great input! Thanks for the
Great input! Thanks for the information.
meglodon
Posts: 5981
Date Joined: 17/06/10
You are right sea-kem
it is all speculation, however all caring types (except, except the lounge loving green and environmental types) are waiting with baited breath for testing results to come in and, a survey to be done to try and evaluate just how much damage has been done to the snapper breeding bio mass in the sound.
Just wait until the green and environmental types have a meeting or love in or what ever else they call it when more than two of them get together.
I will give them such a hazing they will not dare to show their faces for a hell of a long time.
little johnny
Posts: 5362
Date Joined: 04/12/11
I don't no anyone
Who could do tests. But I bet not hard to get fresh dead fish if wanted . If they don't know by now something very wrong . Dtrain are you fisheries ?? You are correct radiation doesn't travel far Through water .Hence just outside coat hanger. Small boats compound. Collie ledge. Everything dead within 1 kilometre off coat hanger. Swam nth end all alive. Even rock crabs dead Sth end. All big orange ones on rocks gone? Sorry but this is bu$$@'t. Def not industry. Would have been on news and solved. If anyone on site knows someone who could possibly solve deaths of fish. Iam sure most would donate to find out real cause. Gone on to long now. Good news someone I know doing pots seen very healthy fish outside sound. Also different area someone else seen healthy fish outside sound on surface. ??? Why are they there? Should be inside ???? Be like aeroplane that was shot down. Will never know?? Bet last dollar on that. Sad but true.
fishinguy
Posts: 125
Date Joined: 16/06/15
how come non of the sharks
how come non of the sharks are been killed? there are tiger sharks and bronzwhaler sharks caught everyday at woodmans point.
Dream fish to catch:
Giant herring.
Cobia.
Uluabuster
Posts: 725
Date Joined: 12/12/10
Volunteered to give the
Volunteered to give the samples of freshly gutted & scaled herrings & snook that I kept on Sat to Paul who is doing the post mortem but he politely rejected because he needs fresh dead samples or live kicking ones to test.
Howard George
Posts: 544
Date Joined: 10/03/11
wonnerup wetlands.
Some fish died in the wetlands and I gathered them up and sent them away for analysis but they get the best results as to cause if the fish are just barely alive.
Timmo
Posts: 257
Date Joined: 01/03/10
Results
Test results should be available for comment tomorrow from what I hear.
Have been told that someone had notified the authorities last week of what happened but did not give name and cant comment on if they gave name of who was responsible.
Not long now.
little johnny
Posts: 5362
Date Joined: 04/12/11
Had little lady phone me
He is chasing 1 for an independent scientist . Who wants 1. I still can't understand why bullseyes and Crays lived on my ledge everything else dead. Can't be poison. Radiation or fish pox( virus). Anything sheltered lived???? For those who don't dive bullseyes live in caves . Spend most day in them mainly come out at night. Let's see results will be good.
Broome lad
Posts: 191
Date Joined: 16/11/15
So
So Timmo what your basically saying is fisheries have known all along from a tip off what happened but just don't know who surly if they know the cause it won't be hard to pin point who's responsible .?
Timmo
Posts: 257
Date Joined: 01/03/10
most likely
dont want to say anything i could get in trouble for and also say something that i have only heard through a reliable source but basically a guy rang in didnt give his name but mentioned that whoever he works for they were responsible for a stuff up.
Look i could be totally wrong but maybe they need evidence first.
An outcome would be pleasing to us all.
As i said please note that after the grapevine this could be purely speculation thats all i can contribute.
We all would like to know the true reason for the deaths. But will we ever know time will tell.
420casts
Posts: 281
Date Joined: 25/03/13
Disgraceful
Eagerly awaiting results :(
My YouTube channel, Fishing Rigs & How To's and more:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCr9kJWJYyoaOkHRDu1pxszg
@666percentfishing
Jason P
Posts: 521
Date Joined: 16/02/13
Looks like all the fish that
Looks like all the fish that are affected are ones that feed off the bottom, so whatever it is kiling them is located on the seabed. therefore demersals are screwed, pelagic maybe ok???
DM306
crasny1
Posts: 7006
Date Joined: 16/10/08
Recwish West update
Recwish West update 25/11/15
"
Recfishwest strives to keep the fishing community up to date about the mystery deaths of fish in Cockburn Sound over the last few days.
CURRENT SITUATION
We are making it priority to keep the community informed with any information Recfishwest receive.
"I would like to die on Mars. Just not on impact!!" _ Elon Musk
grantarctic1
Posts: 2546
Date Joined: 03/03/11
In your
In your opinion crasny, what types of toxins could cause the liver and kidneys to deteriorate so fast. Just asking, you don't have to answer if you don't want to, I understand these things are still just speculation at this point in time.
crasny1
Posts: 7006
Date Joined: 16/10/08
See PM
Don't want to speculate on here. Enough of that already
"I would like to die on Mars. Just not on impact!!" _ Elon Musk
sea-kem
Posts: 15039
Date Joined: 30/11/09
Can you pass on your
Can you pass on your thoughts to me too Crasny? I actually think you have a clue.
Love the West!
meglodon
Posts: 5981
Date Joined: 17/06/10
I suspect that we are only seeing a fraction
I strongly suspect that we are only seeing a small fraction of the fish that have been killed. Whilst that is bad enough one has to wonder what damage has been done to the eggs produced by the breeding activity. If they have been killed in large numbers then there is going to be some long term damage done.
Fingers crossed for the future of some great iconic fishing in the future.
little johnny
Posts: 5362
Date Joined: 04/12/11
good report
Cransy1 .??? Don't think we will ever find out. Toxins pollutions virus oxygen all taken out equation . Now what ? And who. ? This one has been pushed under carpet. Like all them poor people shot down in aeroplane . To big ???
Moking
Posts: 1252
Date Joined: 30/05/12
Latest Update- Cockburn
Latest Update- Cockburn Sound: Fisheries give all clear for Fishing/ Swimming.
UPDATE ON COCKBURN SOUND FISH DEATHS
FISHING AND SWIMMING OKAY AGAIN IN COCKBURN SOUND
The Department of Fisheries testing on water samples as part of the multi-agency investigation into last weekend’s fish deaths in Cockburn Sound has so far found no evidence of a chemical source being responsible. Biosecurity research scientist Dr Michael Snow said the tests on water and fish tissue samples from the sound had been inconclusive but they did indicate elevated levels of a naturally-occurring bacterium that may be harmful to fish, however, this was unlikely to be the primary cause of the event.
“Testing will continue on samples of dead fish, along with further monitoring of water, but for now health authorities have given the all clear for fishers and swimmers,” he said.
The Department of Health advises people:
Dr Snow said an investigation by the Department of Environment Regulation had to date not identified evidence of a significant reported pollution event in Cockburn Sound.
“Screening of water samples for the presence of harmful algal bloom species and their toxins by the Department of Health has also not identified levels of concern to human health,” he said.
“The search continues for a possible cause, through laboratory investigations on dead fish samples collected from the sound, but the wide range of tests required means that reports will not be available until at least late next week,” Dr Snow said.
“We investigate somewhere between 20-30 fish kills per year in Western Australia. The majority are in inland waters and caused by low water quality often associated with algal blooms.
“The fact this event has occurred in more open ocean means we have less evidence of a direct cause to go on and we are having to explore all possible explanations. It may be the case that a single definitive cause cannot be identified, but we are continuing the search.”
Any fish kills should be reported to FISHWATCH on 1800 815 507.
My Dad taught me how to Fish-Thanks Dad.(RIP)
Walfootrot
Posts: 1385
Date Joined: 23/07/12
It could be that we just
It could be that we just pushed the sound to far. Closed half the sound with that limestone going to GI, desalination plant and all the rest, May have only taken 1 little thing to push it over the edge.
More drum lines, kill the bloody sharks!
Wahoo
Posts: 243
Date Joined: 11/06/07
It probably
doesn't help that instead of taking action on the Fri/Sat they waited until Monday to take test samples. I'd hate to see the reaction time if there was a huge oil spill for example - will the suitable gov't departments wait until office hours on a weekday to act in that instance too?
Fishin for a feed and fun.
Swompa
Posts: 3910
Date Joined: 14/10/12
Finally on the Ch9 Facebook
Finally on the Ch9 Facebook page.