flares it has been confirmed
Submitted by meglodon on Sun, 2012-07-29 23:34
just had a bit of news from a reliable source that as from july 1 2013 DoT are introducing a new policy on flares,if you are found to be in possesion of flares that are out of date you will be liable to a fine of 250 bucks for having life saving gear that is out of date. I have expressed my view on this mad bad policy before on this web site and look forward to my first encounter with DoT on this issue It will be interesting to see on what basis they have brought in this change (it will interest the RAN as well)
It's chicken shit at it's best by people who have not the remotest idea what they are on about,nor the qualifications to make such decissions.
hlokk
Posts: 4290
Date Joined: 04/04/08
Surely it would be "If the
Surely it would be "If the only flares you have are out of date". E.g. two sets, one in date and the other not, you would still be fine, or wont they even let you keep expired flares in addition to in date ones?
Perhaps the people who changed the policy do have an idea of what they're on about, but from a legal point of view rather than a practical usage view? I.e. flare says expired, therefore expired, end of story. I guess perhaps they want to stop any ambiguity over what constitutes good condition (but expired) flares? However, for recreational boaters, its not like the flares instantly go bad... A balance needs to be struck between practically and pragmatism. So is there anything to suggest the current rules arent acceptable? How many boaties have had expired flares not work in an emergency situation?
Buz
Posts: 1555
Date Joined: 28/08/07
Guess if this is to be the
Guess if this is to be the norm there may become a niche for a company to sell flares that have a longer 'expired' date. E.g at the moment you dont care because as long as they are in good condition they should pass inspection. In the future you will probably end up buying which ever set is going to last you the longest.
Or who knows there might be a when your old set expires drop them off at a designated place and get some credit $ towards your new set??? Hmmmm then again this is W.A so not holding my breath.
hlokk
Posts: 4290
Date Joined: 04/04/08
Now now Buz, that last idea
Now now Buz, that last idea is sensible. We cant have that, particularly when a government is involved....... (that would be funny if it werent so sad :s).
Would also be interesting if you could get them checked. I suspect some of the reason for shorter expirys is that the environment they're stored in can affect their life. E.g. hot and humid vs cool and dry. They need to cover their ass for most situations, so would be interesting if for a couple of bucks they could be inspected, and you get a stickered extension on them? Again, see above comment though :(
leesfishin
Posts: 233
Date Joined: 27/03/11
was checked last week at
was checked last week at shark bay, was told new reg was in from 1july 2012 and received a warning for my flares being out of date.
have until 1 jan before it is compulsary
cheers lee
snappermiles
Posts: 2100
Date Joined: 05/11/10
another way the useless government is screwing us over
all this will do is have more flare sightings from land as when there out of date what are you going to do with them?? throw them in the bin and have a possible accident waiting to happen?? just another way of them making money
ALL FISHERMEN ARE LIARS EXCEPT YOU AND ME! AND IM NOT SO SURE ABOUT YOU!
opsrey
Posts: 1200
Date Joined: 05/10/07
Come in spinners
This is another money spinner for our local economy. Come on fellers it has to be good for us. There has been soo many problems with the old regulation, you know.... The one that says flares need to be in good condition. Heck there is no way my ten year old flares would ever work, is there.... $$$. :)
shortfuse
Posts: 211
Date Joined: 02/01/12
This stuff just makes my
This stuff just makes my blood boil! If such changes are going to happen why hasn't everyone with a skippers ticket been informed prior to changes in rules. Everyone with a skippers ticket is sent a crappy news letter thats full of useless information and important stuff like this is left out.
crasny1
Posts: 7003
Date Joined: 16/10/08
I have 3 sets off flares
And 2 are out off date. In an emergency I will use the older ones first. That is if I am not panicking and shooting whichever packet I get my hands on!!! If they dont work or are missed. then you have a backup fresher packet.
Now what Hlokk says has me thinking aswell. Even though I have a new set in date onboard, could I be fined fot having older sets, because that just ken stinks.
I would like to fight this battle in court if it ever eventuate. The more the merryer.
"I would like to die on Mars. Just not on impact!!" _ Elon Musk
pale ale
Posts: 1755
Date Joined: 02/01/10
In Qld, it is illegal to keep
In Qld, it is illegal to keep old flares as they are considered "explosives"
carnarvonite
Posts: 8669
Date Joined: 24/07/07
Submission
The written submission I put in was that if a set was more than 2 years out of date then you had to obtain a new set, seems like our DoT manager didn't disuade the others on the committee.
If the Qid regs come in it we will look forward to more false alarm flare sightings because if you cannot get rid of them properly then its off to the dump and a chance of them falling in the wrong hands.
Going back about 2 years some one ratted the old trawlers laid up here and stole all the flare packs and until a couple of months back we had flare sightings in and around town that all required a call out of our crew to check on whether they were an emergency or not. I know what I would have done with a flare if we caught them.
hlokk
Posts: 4290
Date Joined: 04/04/08
I'd feel sorry for that damn
I'd feel sorry for that damn flare knowing exactly what would happen to it! The guy deserves the full extent of the law coming to him though! I think when they had that guy putting out fake radio calls that he was charged. I assume its an offense to set off a flare when its not an emergency.
If you are required to immediately dispose of expired (but otherwise completely fine!) flares, then what are the options for this? At the moment, I know some sea rescue groups take expired flares, and then can later use them in training. However, if its "illegal" to hold them, then sea rescue groups may not be allowed to used expired flares for demonstration flares, because obviously they're extremely dangerous causing hundreds of deaths a year *rolls eyes*.
Walfootrot
Posts: 1385
Date Joined: 23/07/12
This was updated on Firday 27
This was updated on Firday 27 July
http://www.transport.wa.gov.au/imarine/19165.asp#Expiry_dates
Best be getting some new flares if your are out of date.
You can hand the old ones in at Freo. think the cops will take them off your hands too
More drum lines, kill the bloody sharks!
carnarvonite
Posts: 8669
Date Joined: 24/07/07
Old flares
Dept of Transport has the facilities to handle and collect out of date flares, just contact them and they will give you the details on where to drop them off. I'm sure your local sea rescue groups will take them if you drop them off at one of the bases as well, I know we do here in Carnarvon.
Now that its coming in no doubt there will be many more flare demonstrations done by the sea rescue groups so if you see an advert in your local paper come along and learn how to set them off safely and see what they look like once in action. That way we can all recognise what to look for and not just the few of us who deal with them all the time.
Iceman
Posts: 747
Date Joined: 17/03/09
Meeting
I will be attending a Search and Rescue Council meeting on Wednesday. DOT will be there so will try to clarification on whether you can have out of date flares onboard provided you in date flares as well.
As for dropping off the rescue groups, we were advised we cannot use out of date flares for demos. Will clarify this as well. many time we have found older flares (if looked after) work better than new flares.
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meglodon
Posts: 5981
Date Joined: 17/06/10
flares a question
for my money any flare is better than no flare,i'll keep my out of date flares onboard and if i need to attract the attention of some one because of an emergency i'll light up the sky with everything i've got.the question to be put to DoT is
if old flares are kept and can be redily identified as out of date what is the problem of keeping them.
Most sea rescue groups used to hold flare demo nights with out of date flares what was the problem with this.
Dizzy
Posts: 753
Date Joined: 21/02/11
Let's have an annual
Let's have an annual "Fishwrecked Expired Flare Party" on DOT's doorstep.
.... It'd be the only time that a bright spark goes anwhere near that building each year !
snappermiles
Posts: 2100
Date Joined: 05/11/10
gold dizzy gold
gold dizzy gold
ALL FISHERMEN ARE LIARS EXCEPT YOU AND ME! AND IM NOT SO SURE ABOUT YOU!
mejutty
Posts: 96
Date Joined: 21/12/09
Given I need to dispose of my
Given I need to dispose of my out of date flares where can I safley set off/test/dispose of them?? Would be nice to actuall see what I'm in for if (touch wood) I need to use them.
Perfish
Posts: 103
Date Joined: 15/11/11
Agree
I've seen flares set off before but it'd be usefull for my regular crew and gillie to see the same so they 1) know what to expect when setting one off and 2) how to use them if needed and I'm unable to.
I recon a controlled 'open day' run by DOT in conjunction with the sea rescue organizations would be a winner
Man with line in water catches fish!
You only get what you always got if you only do what you've always done!
Lamby
Posts: 3145
Date Joined: 04/08/09
Pisser Dizzy, nice one
Pisser Dizzy, nice one