My thoughts on new rules
And others that have been introduced over the years .no iam not anti vax syco .Love the ocean . Start with cockburn CRABS . They took away tangle nets . And replaced them with traps ( not pots ) crabs cannot escape ,they caught 24 hours a day . Blue manna crabs ( males ) leave . All fertile females stay behind . Traps still catching all females with eggs inside body . Amature fault I don’t think so . CRAYS how many amatures fish outside 35 to 40 meters and catch jumbo oversized females ( divers not included) with fur not many . DHUES how many people would keep a dhue under 500 mm . No one I know . They say target other fish . Let’s go for MULLYS . Mullaway are a family group rarely intermingle with other schools . Once you have your prime spot you will wipe out generations of family gone. Hence why my family members stoped going for them . Only 2 to 3 times a year now days . SNAPPER are like blowfish atm . Endangered my ass cockburn pollution stopped huge schools coming in . Back of 5 fathom and beyond pain in ass . My summary of everything if new stupid rules come in . Few years time dhues in local area will be gone ( no breeders left) education in how to handle and bring in fish the way to make fish survive . Amatures will be to blame . Crays stocks drop well der be amatures fault for giving away to many crays . Not pros taking all big breeders . Taking female crabs ( no sign of eggs internal ) but the whole crab industry is in danger . Be amatures fault due to people getting caught with undersized crabs .not traps fault . Look list goes on . I have spent my whole life in water on water . To me it seems they do not want any amature taking anything . They make more money out of pros than the common person . They will not be happy until they take everything away . My bitch / my thoughts on what I have seen only . Is it about how much money they can make . Or is it real concern about stock ? I have my doubts . Each to there own . If it was me I wouldn’t do there surveys / frames / logs . It bites you in ass . As far as public forums go , it’s a free world . My bitch over . First day back at work fustration gone
Moking
Posts: 1252
Date Joined: 30/05/12
" Merry Christmas LJ" Keep
" Merry Christmas LJ"
Keep chilling out on the Ocean...that's what I do!
My Dad taught me how to Fish-Thanks Dad.(RIP)
Marineboy
Posts: 842
Date Joined: 14/03/14
Rule changes
Something had to be done !
it's become harder today to catch a quality fish metro than it was 5 years ago and even harder than it was 10 years ago and so on, I'm a diver and we don't see as many demersals on dives as we did 5 years ago and even less than we did 10 years ago and so on.
regard less of what was done we as humans hate change and would whinge and the bottom line is the new regs could have been a whole lot worse than what they are, hopefully fish stocks will be monitored closely over the next few years and adjustments and tweaks to current new rules can be made.
whiting rule !
My spots are so secret even the fish don't know about them !
sunshine
Posts: 2611
Date Joined: 03/03/09
You are obviously a LOT younger than me
I moved to WA in the 70's. Bought my first boat in the early 80's. I was far far more active fishing and diving wise back then yet I can count on ONE hand how many dhufish I caught in the metro area from the time I got the boat until 2003.
Caught heaps further north, even caught them off the beach at a secret location so I am no bunny. Early in 2003 (someone will correct me if it was a year either side) Pro Cray Boats were banned from using drop lines which was a common practice until that time. Talk about wasteful fishing, fish hooked were left to shark predation or simply died and went off in our warm waters before being harvested.
Within two years of that ban I was regularly catching dhu in metro waters, seeing schools of them when diving and regularly seeing them in shallow metro waters. That ONE change made a massive difference to metro fish stocks. OK I fully accept that better boats and more importantly better sounder tech has impacted but I can still go out and catch metro dhu with relative ease. What other changes can i comment upon.?....
Gummys were almost unheard of in metro waters until a few years ago now they are as thick as fleas on a mangy dog.
Snapper are now in plague proportions, sure many are on the 45cm range ( which in any other State would be considered legal indeed a 45cm is considered large) . But they are about in huge numbers
My personal take on the metro scene is that, contrary to what you assert, metro fishing is way way better than it was twenty years ago. I no longer dive metro after a white encounter though I still dive up north so you may be seeing something I am not and I wholly accept that because in five years early 2000 I saw the extinction of pencil urchins , giant snails and tunn shells which the non-diver would be wholly unaware ......yes our waters are changing but don't blame amateurs
scotto
Posts: 2470
Date Joined: 21/04/08
Correct
Took the words right out of my mouth.
carnarvonite
Posts: 8672
Date Joined: 24/07/07
Metro
Think it was around 2002-2003 they shut down commercial demersal shark netting from just north of Myalup to Lancelin effectively shutting the door to three or four pro boats that continually worked the area, a mate of mine who was based in Two Rocks nearly blew a fuse when he heard of the proposal and no one would go near him when it actually happened effectively cutting more than half his total catch in one blow.
Marineboy
Posts: 842
Date Joined: 14/03/14
Amateurs
At no stage did I blame amateurs in my post, I merely posting my observations as a fisher and diver.
My spots are so secret even the fish don't know about them !
stricko
Posts: 224
Date Joined: 10/05/10
The worst part about the
The worst part about the cray boats losing their wet line part of there lic was the way fisheries wa handled it they were told from my understanding that if they didn't have catch history for wet fish they would lose that part of their lic so for 4 to 5 years from memory they all started wet lining manly during off season and the fish of choice was dhuies. Boats that wouldn't normally bother making sure they could show history and than fisheries shit canned it which they should have done to start with i remember seeing big catches getting unloaded off cray boats at this time had never seen it before.
Curndog
Posts: 449
Date Joined: 21/11/16
Maybe we should blame all
Maybe we should blame all the sharks and have a cull. That was for you merman
little johnny
Posts: 5360
Date Joined: 04/12/11
New dhue rule to many fish
Should stick to original conditions . And limits with .6 month ban . They halved time we can fish. But doubled dhue quota. What will that save ?
Faulkner Family
Posts: 18034
Date Joined: 11/03/08
You got that spot on.
You got that spot on. Everyone will be after the dhuies regardless of size people will be keeping them . Hopefully those that respect the fish will do what is moral and release the ones that were under size by the previous rules. I can see down the track there won't be any left out there to breed as all the juvenile ones will be removed from their environment. Then who will be to blame. The so called experts as they allowed it to happen
RUSS and SANDY. A family that fishes together stays together
BlueKiaser
Posts: 422
Date Joined: 22/04/15
Less than half, closer to a third
Our new 2023 bans are about 6 months. 2022 was 2 months.
If you calculate the actual reduction in fishable days (down from 10 months to 6 months) it works out to be 39% ... quite a bit less than 50%.
That is, while the new restrictions mean we can only fish half of 2023, we haven't been able to fish a full year for many years.
Which makes your post even more valid ... our retained Recreational Dhuie catch which is over 50% of our total private recreational boat tonnage caught in the West Coast Region, may well increase.
scotto
Posts: 2470
Date Joined: 21/04/08
Marineboy
I dont agree with you marineboy. I dive a lot during cray season. Since they stopped the pros fishing metro, I have seen a MASSIVE increase in numbers of dhu and baldys. I regularly see up to 8-10 a dive. Some just sized, some just under.
my problem is with no size limits on these, they will certainly disappear over the next 6-12 months, garaunteed. Good work fisheries.
Marineboy
Posts: 842
Date Joined: 14/03/14
Scotto
Like I said these are my observations, I've dived and fished for a long time (first started diving in 1976 not sure you were even born then) and also regularly night fish and I'm not getting the results I was 5+ years ago.
My spots are so secret even the fish don't know about them !
Jackfrost80
Posts: 8147
Date Joined: 07/05/12
If you need a few whiting
If you need a few whiting marks let me know..
Officially off the Pies bandwagon
Marineboy
Posts: 842
Date Joined: 14/03/14
Spots
Pm me your hot spots, love whiting.
My spots are so secret even the fish don't know about them !
Brock O
Posts: 3233
Date Joined: 11/01/08
I don't understand peoples
I don't understand peoples thoughts and not understanding why the no size limit has been added.
Always hearing these stories the Dhue released well swam straight back down..we caught the same Dhue heaps of times there release well etc etc.
Will always be dickheads trying to upgrade unfortunately.
Marineboy
Posts: 842
Date Joined: 14/03/14
Release well
Exactly brock, as a diver if we surface too quickly the effects of barrotrauma aren't immediate, we can still walk and swim (unless it's a bad bend) and the effects come on later much the same as a fish.
My spots are so secret even the fish don't know about them !
Marineboy
Posts: 842
Date Joined: 14/03/14
Double
Double
My spots are so secret even the fish don't know about them !
uncle
Posts: 9486
Date Joined: 10/02/07
What's the point of a dhu
Under 50 cm
all aggressive fish love bigjohnsjigs
Marineboy
Posts: 842
Date Joined: 14/03/14
Dhue under 50cm
Still feed 2 people with a 40cm dhuie if filleted well.
My spots are so secret even the fish don't know about them !
Jackfrost80
Posts: 8147
Date Joined: 07/05/12
Enough for you and the Mrs at
Enough for you and the Mrs at least.
Officially off the Pies bandwagon
Brock O
Posts: 3233
Date Joined: 11/01/08
Similar to a Baldi @ 400mm or
Similar to a Baldi @ 400mm or pinky @ 450mm at a guess. SA pink limit at 450mm. Pretty rare catching them smaller than that JMO.
Throwing them back is a waste of time, guess there thinking is at some point during the day most people accept there bag and stop fishing meaning less damage / released fish.
Reefsta
Posts: 321
Date Joined: 03/08/19
Snapper recovery slow in SA
The snapper ban in SA has been extended another 3+ years due to slow recovery. Could be similalry slow for demersals, especially Dhu, in WA?
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-12-17/sa-snapper-fishing-ban-extended/101784940
Nonetheless, I agree there seem to be plenty of metro pinks the last few years.
BlueKiaser
Posts: 422
Date Joined: 22/04/15
WA "Resilience" plans means 2040+ restrictions
Our WA FIsheries have already documented their plans to impose restrictions to meet their 2030 targets and even then keeping those restrictions for another 10 years (one generation) to build "resilience" in the stocks.
From the management Harvest strategy report;
Fisheries Management Paper No. 305 | Page 17
Recovery Plan Objective
The recovery plan objective is to ecologically recover all indicator species by 2030 (i.e. B>BMSY & F<FThreshold) and once ecologically recovered, increase resilience of all WCDSR indicator species (i.e. B=BTarget & F=FTarget) within one generation, subject to economic and social objectives being met (Figure 6)
Jamie-Chester
Posts: 116
Date Joined: 28/07/10
If next stock assessment bad
If next stock assessment bad then the fishery will be shut down I imagine.
Size limits are there to eliminate baratrauma loss. Spearfishing is selective and therefore should still have size limits.
New regs are a dogs breakfast.
dumper
Posts: 1027
Date Joined: 03/04/08
Is there really a chance of
Is there really a chance of barotrauma inside three mile reef though? There's tons of just undersized baby Dhus and baldies swimming around in the 13-20 metre mark. And the fact that some wood duck can come in and clean four of them out makes me feel a bit crook in the guts
Seaquest
Posts: 1131
Date Joined: 22/10/09
Geo Bay
These new rules will have a huge impact on the dhuy population in Geographe Bay. There are a lot of small dhuies in the bay. Until now they have been off limits. It won't take long until there wiped out.
I can't see the point on having a 6 month ban but doubling the bag limit on dhuies. You are really relying on people doing the right thing with these new rules and not being greedy but we all know that won't happen. Wouldn't it make more sense to keep old limits in place and have a 4 month ban during the spawning season. Ban fishing from the start of November till the end of February for all sectors. If they say the pros have only 20 days on average of fishing days a year why do they need to fish during the spawning period. There is plenty of other fresh fish that people can buy during this time.
Most of the people making these rules have probably never spent a day fishing for demersals. I have been doing it for 30 years and have spent thousands of hours on the water and just can't understand these new rules.
BlueKiaser
Posts: 422
Date Joined: 22/04/15
shallow water survival rates of Dhuies was not the problem
Yes, and very few of those small Geo Bay Dhuies would have previously been dying upon release.
Much of the water depths fished by recreational boaters in Geo Bay is relatively shallow <30m so the vast majority of those <50cm caught Dhuies were being returned in good condition. Over the years, I have released many undersized Dhufish there which have swam down looking very healthy and extremely likely to survive.
And I can now imagine many boaters who travel more than 10 nautical miles out will have every intention of coming home with 4 good sized Dhuies.
<50cm Dhuies caught in the 40m+ depths will now likely be kept until upgraded later to a bigger specimen.
The numbers tell me that these new rules will more than likely result in a greater number of Dhufish (by quantity and tonnage) killed than previously, especially in places like Geographe Bay. So I fail to see how Fisheries expect to see a 50% reduction in the West Coast Bioregion recreational demersal catch when Dhufish typically account for about half of that total demersal tonnage caught.
Bodgy 79
Posts: 287
Date Joined: 04/08/22
As an outsider looking in I
As an outsider looking in I have a few thoughts & questions. How many boats are out from your ramp on any one day chasing bottom fish? As stated most who fish for them can get onto the Dhus with relative ease so 25 boats at one ramp can potentially bag 100 dhus in a day( that's a lot imo).The dhus generally have the biggest yield and imo are probably the fish that holds its quality in the freezer the best so lots will try for the freezer chocka full of Dhu for the off season.Rules are rules so fair game until fisheries ect conduct stock assessments over next couple of years and say the Recs have fucked the dhu population again and who know what regs they would change then.I sit on the south coast and wonder how this can be a good outcome for the Dhu which I thought was one of the prime species they want to manage better for future stocks,especially when pros can still target them year round. A bit baffled to be honest
sunshine
Posts: 2611
Date Joined: 03/03/09
Dhuies yield poorly
They certainly do not provide the biggest yield. Far from it, KGW and gummies probably provide the best return per fish with the minimum of waste, dhuie head weighs heavy and apart from wings and cheeks gives minimal return. Vacuum packing dry (never wash when filletting) and fillets can and do last over a year and thaw like caught yesterday so unlike a few years ago when freezer burn was the limiting factor there should be little to no wasting of fillets.
Bodgy 79
Posts: 287
Date Joined: 04/08/22
Yeah I understand the ratios
Yeah I understand the ratios but we are talking about demersals bag,size & boat limits.Not sure about you but I would generally collect more meat off of 4 dhus than 4 black ass or similar so a boat with 3 or 4 blokes on board one would assume they would generally target the dhus for that reason.
davewillo
Posts: 2410
Date Joined: 08/09/16
I don't really fish for
I don't really fish for demersals but I think the dhu limit of 4 is fucking stupid. I'm no conspiracy theorist but those who have said we're being set up for a larger or total ban could be onto something. Let the recs catch more dhus and smaller and I have no doubt the stocks will be fucked and then the fishermen will be next.
PGFC member and lure tragic
little johnny
Posts: 5360
Date Joined: 04/12/11
100 percent
.
selthy
Posts: 296
Date Joined: 27/05/11
Haven't had the chance to
Haven't had the chance to fully read and form an opinion as yet, however the latest Boat Based Rec Survey shows us Recs are catching less dhuies in the West Coast Bioregion than we were in 17/18. Page 154 www.fish.wa.gov.au/Documents/research_reports/frr327.pdf
This is the survey I was banging on about during the consulation process. The data used for the papers presented to the public during the process was based off a 17/18 survey, yet DPIRD completed a further survey in 20/21 and confirmed the release of the data was imminent... So WTF would the fisheries minister authorise and present papers to the public based on out of date data. What is he hiding, and why release the updated data within 2 weeks of annuncing new fishing rules?
It would be very interesting to see an updated stock evaluation using this 20/21 data rather than 17/18!!!
barracuda
Posts: 217
Date Joined: 01/09/13
Little Johnny
Your a legend . Full stop .....
little johnny
Posts: 5360
Date Joined: 04/12/11
Every fisherman knows it’s to
Much . They will get smashed . Anyway new Cosco store in Kwinana has unreal cheap seafood . Prawns are unreal ( huge)
timboon
Posts: 2957
Date Joined: 14/11/10
Packaged in Australia from
Packaged in Australia from at least 2% Australian ingredients LJ??
Fuck there would've been a lot of Vietnamese turd infested prawns sucked back yesterday...
Bodgy 79
Posts: 287
Date Joined: 04/08/22
Yeah it's bullshit
Yeah it's bullshit hey,thousands of km of pristine wa coast chockas full of arguably the best prime seafood in the world and our supermarkets serve the old sewer farmed prawns,fuck it's not even Aussie shit they eat.That garbage shouldn't even make it across our borders
stricko
Posts: 224
Date Joined: 10/05/10
Been a bit suss of the
Been a bit suss of the Australian farmed prawns as i heard they in port the feed from asia and it smells like raw sewage if not refrigerated wild caught for me and australian. Wild caught imported haven't tried but farmed no way.
Willlo
Posts: 1490
Date Joined: 07/10/11
Spot on John. What gets me
Spot on John. What gets me is all rec fishos south of Mandurah are paying the price for what is taken in metro areas. Also the rules seem tuned to metro as well. Completely different ground down hear as to what you find in the metro area.
Call Sign - BZ785
Haynes Hunter Prowler CC
Jsmolly
Posts: 187
Date Joined: 10/04/12
When you then go into
When you then go into certain fish shops and there is 100% female crabs the hyporcicy just screams out.
little johnny
Posts: 5360
Date Joined: 04/12/11
My very first encounter with fisheries was
When I was about 11 years old. I use to get on bmx bike . Dive gear in bag , gloves. Straight to s/bay . I got told off for only taking male crabs . I was causing an imbalance in crab population . A male can mate many times with many females ( crabs only not being rude) . I’ve always been taught only keep males / females the stock . How many people remember mandurah 40 plus years ago . Monster crabs . Same will happen with crays again soon . Taking breeding stock . This year no where near as good as last few years. ( taking main stock big breeders) but these 2 cracker items will be blamed on amateur fisherman .anyway rant over . Back to painting
piscetor
Posts: 186
Date Joined: 13/05/16
S/bay
i remember safety bay bck in the sixties. i went to S?BAY primary school and in the summer would dash home put the goggles and flippers on and dive for occy and cobbler around the cray boats that used to be there. the sand bar was out by the lead lights and we would get herring by the bucket off of the original safety bay jetty and watch Crom Wilson pull the cray boats out to clean the bottoms on the slipway that he operated along side the jetty. in the summer at night you could fill a baby bath with crabs walking with a scoop and a tilly lamp. But like all things with age comes change, bigger population and coastal changes also means change in habitat. I dived the five and shoalwater for crays and dhu fish and got my share. The biggest dhuie i have ever seen was in shoalwater bay behind the horseshoe reef it would have gone over fifty pounds no problems and it was in 24 foot of water. We also used to see big blue groper at the back of the five fathom but i don't know if they still live there or if they have been shot out ( i hope not ).
I think we all wish that things never change but they do. Do you remember when snapper only needed to be 450mm?
Filletmaster
little johnny
Posts: 5360
Date Joined: 04/12/11
Crom is one who taught me
The most.knots / rigs ect. Snowdrop ( wife ) old george . Happy Harry still alive. He started taking me out when he got his shark cat . I used to spend all my time at s/bay jetty . Remember big swing out arm on jetty ? That was what he used for car body’s ( car wreck) tons of them .more towards long point . One night trawler stuffed the lot . I still have part of jetty in shed ( when they cut it up). Was an unreal place when I was in primary school .Occy/squid/crabs/herring/cobbler/storm gardies /pilch everywhere . Crap now . Use to steal box of redhead matches of parents . Ally foil shoot butter fish . Lite a small fire on beach , throw them in fire rapped up ( good lunch) also used to be heaps of big flounder when crabs where in. Great days
piscetor
Posts: 186
Date Joined: 13/05/16
He was a local legend.
i spoke to a bloke that used to hide behind penguin island and try to shadow Crom to his fishing/cray grounds but Croms boat ( JUDY) was to fast. I went and pulled set lines with Crom when i was 11/12 years old. bad weather was a part of it and some times a bit frightening but Crom would just pat me on the back and say nothing to worry about. i don't know if his german sheperd was still around when you knew him. it used to come down to the jetty and wait for his boat to come in, the thing was the boat was still way out past the rocks but the dog knew he was coming. Crom would give it his cane food basket and the dog would take it up to the house and then come back down. Crom was the bloke that gave me my love of fishing. And i remember his shark cat and the day i saw him on the jetty, hand bandaged after putting a shark hook throught it. He was one hard man that was for sure, but a gentleman with it.
And they were great times and really good people.
Filletmaster