Sounder question

 G'day everyone,

Ive recently been doing a bit of research on interpeting my lowrance HDS sounder and I've read conflicting information in regards to the difference between using 50kHz and 200kHz. Would I be correct in saying you would use 200kHz in shallower water say up to 100m? Also the angle of the echo sound cone at 200kHz is less than 50kHz?

 

From what I can gather it appears we should use 200kHz most of the time (unless you're going to fish serious deep water off Exmouth for example).

 

Would be greatly appreciated if anyone can share their knowledge on this subject.

 

Cheers

 

Ben

____________________________________________________________________________

Do the right thing and there will be fish tomorrow.


Posts: 354

Date Joined: 25/03/09

200 for shallower water as

Thu, 2013-05-23 04:42

200 for shallower water as the higher frequency gives better definition but will not penetrate as deep into the water . Should get to 100 M easily. The 50 will punch deeper but also as the cone is going deeper it is wider. Think icecream cone upside down ,that is pretty much your sounders beam.

Paul H's picture

Posts: 2104

Date Joined: 18/01/07

200 is a wider cone than

Thu, 2013-05-23 08:18

200 is a wider cone than 50khz (at the same depth).  I don't fish in over 100m but I sometimes use the 50khz - mostly use 200khz though,  You can put a split screen of 50khz and 200khz up at the same time and this will show you the differences in what each beam shows such as in the link below

http://fishwrecked.com/image/sounder-shot

 

Cheers

 

____________________________________________________________________________

Youtube Channel  -  FishOnLine Productions

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCbUVNa-ViyGm_FTDSv4Nqzg/videos

chris raff's picture

Posts: 3257

Date Joined: 09/02/10

Paul will give that split

Thu, 2013-05-23 09:07

Paul will give that split screen a run next time out .. any idea Paul what the difference in cone size would be in say 30m ? I presume that info could be determined by using the A scope , which we are still trying to get a handle on . Quite often we'll catch fish that don't show up on the sounder at all even whilst anchored , with baits close to boat . I think the speed scroll is set to 1x presuming that would be right when not moving around too much ..    

____________________________________________________________________________

Intelligence is like a four-wheel drive. It only allows you to get stuck in more remote places.”

Griffo84's picture

Posts: 118

Date Joined: 28/05/10

Thanks for the info

Thu, 2013-05-23 12:50

Thanks for the info boys.

 

Interesting sounder shot there Paul. The 200kHz certainly shows more detail compared to the 50kHz. There seems to be conflicting information out there in regards to this subject as the below link explains the 50kHz has a wider cone angle and penetrates deeper than 200kHz and the 200kHz has a narrower angle however it picks up more detail in shallower water. At the end of the day Paul you have proven 200kHz is certainly the best choice for fishing shallower depths.

 

Chris - If the info in the below link is correct you would expect your sounder to pick up approximately 115ft (about 34m) of ground (Using 200kHz) in 100ft (about 30m) of water.

 

http://www.fishsniffer.com/forums/marine-electronics/94326-50-200khz-vs-83-200-khz-transducer.html

 

It's always interesting to learn more about our sounders because the fact is we've spent big bucks on them and many of us don't know how to use them properly - if at all!! :-)

____________________________________________________________________________

Do the right thing and there will be fish tomorrow.

chris raff's picture

Posts: 3257

Date Joined: 09/02/10

Cheers Griffo ... that last

Thu, 2013-05-23 17:18

Cheers Griffo ... that last statement is very true lol , my auto function used be always turned on ..

____________________________________________________________________________

Intelligence is like a four-wheel drive. It only allows you to get stuck in more remote places.”

Paul H's picture

Posts: 2104

Date Joined: 18/01/07

Also heard conflicting info

Thu, 2013-05-23 18:12

Also heard conflicting info re beam widths  - Given the beams are cone shaped if the 50 is 'wider' then by the time it gets to say 200m your going to have one hell of a wide beam across the bottom (it will then be picking up many differing depth returns where you are (assuming the bottom is undulating and not flat) and have too much trouble "averaging" the bottom return to determine the 'average' depth to display in 2D. 

Remebering the bean is cone shaped say 2 metres to the left side of the boat the depth is 48m and 2 metres to the right side it is 52m (and your stationary).  To display this in 2D the unit averages this and would theoretically displays a depth of 50 at that point.  Just because your sounder says it 50m deep doesn't mean that is 50m deep consistantly throughout the beam - that would often be impossible given some bottom compositions.

If the 50 is wider why is it picking up less fish/returns in my split screen - obvious answer would be that it is narrower and thus picking up less returns from the fish.  could also be the type of return given the differing frequencies - Thats my thoughts anyway!!

Cheers

paul

____________________________________________________________________________

Youtube Channel  -  FishOnLine Productions

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCbUVNa-ViyGm_FTDSv4Nqzg/videos

Posts: 211

Date Joined: 02/01/12

What george jungle said is

Thu, 2013-05-23 14:19

What george jungle said is correct for typical transducers, if you want to know for sure you need to know what transducer you have 90% are made by airmar for most brands. Check their website for details regard your transducer specs it will provide the cone angle for each frequency and what the width is for each at a number of depth intervals

Posts: 211

Date Joined: 02/01/12

Paul here's some info for

Thu, 2013-05-23 19:35

Paul here's some info for you

you can check it out for your self if you like

 

Typical specs for the very common P66 transducer

 

Cone angle @50khz  45degrees                                                      @200khz   11degrees

bottom coverage @ 9m or 30' =8m                                                 @9m = 2m

                         @ 30m or100'  =25m                                            @30m = 6m

                         @122m or 400' =26m                                           @122m =26m

                         @305m or1000' =252m                                        @305m = 64m

 thats the specs from the manufacturer

as already said transducers do vary in cone angles but in almost all cases 50khz is a wider

 

Paul H's picture

Posts: 2104

Date Joined: 18/01/07

Thanks shortfuse - the

Thu, 2013-05-23 19:45

Thanks shortfuse - the difference in the return must be due to the differing frequency then not the width of the beam.

____________________________________________________________________________

Youtube Channel  -  FishOnLine Productions

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCbUVNa-ViyGm_FTDSv4Nqzg/videos

Posts: 354

Date Joined: 25/03/09

Paul 50 is wider than 200

Fri, 2013-05-24 16:33

Paul 50 is wider than 200 trust me on this

Posts: 307

Date Joined: 01/09/09

Beam width

Fri, 2013-05-24 20:18

 Looking at those beam widths and angles one would think the guys fishing super deep would have a hard time marking fish with a cone width off 250m @ 50 khz !!! You could be miles off the mark and not know it .. 

How ever no one runs a 600 w out deep and it makes you think about running a 1kw  200 kHz for super deep to put you closer to the mark ???

Cheers fishfish 

Posts: 354

Date Joined: 25/03/09

Yeah the cone is massive at

Sat, 2013-05-25 04:36

Yeah the cone is massive at that depth it is very hard to drop a bait 400M and hit the fish with the tide drift and wind as factors as well, 1 kw 200 khz wont hit the bottom at those depths