Fish ban

Has anyone heard there thinking of ( suggesting) a 5 month ban ?


deep south's picture

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No but

Fri, 2021-10-15 19:05

 No but nothing would surprise me , yet again they will shit on us while numerous foreign vessels will poach our waters without even a eye being raised

All the measures put in place to preserve fish stocks here and meanwhile the northern waters are getting plundered by indos !!

Go figure ...

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The next time i see that jig will be in the mouth of something big !!

 

Brock O's picture

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West Coast Region...We

Fri, 2021-10-15 19:06

West Coast Region...We already have strict catch limits and seasonal restrictions, If additional seasonal restriction or smaller closed areas were added youd like it to be well supported.

The snapper spawning seems to be in a good place, the demersal restriction are covering the main Oct / Nov period although dhue fish for example spawn through to April.

little johnny's picture

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Reason I asked

Fri, 2021-10-15 19:09

Someone asked me . Some meeting or something. I don’t know the truth . News to me

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5 month demersal closure is

Sat, 2021-10-16 08:56

5 month demersal closure is on it's way.

been agreed upon and will be happening.

research proposed a 12 month closure initially so we got lucky with the 5.

Extra 3 months will have an impact on the tackle shop guys.

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 5 month closure? They can

Sat, 2021-10-16 09:04

 5 month closure? They can EAD

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 Hi my name is rob............. and I'm a........... fishaholic

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 I personally think removing

Sat, 2021-10-16 09:25

 I personally think removing dhu fish and baldie size limits (face it 90% of the fish that surface won't survive) and also increasing dhu fish bag limit to 2 with a boat limit of 4 will be far more beneficial.

me personally and most guys I know that have half a clue can't get away from dhu fish, that hardest part about a days fishing is catching a demersal that isn't a dhu fish.

I am facinated with statistics and I keep a record of what I catch, ratios, length to weight etc etc.

on average I would catch 7 to 1 dhu fish to other demersal species ratio and backed by several years of stats fishing 200+  hours a year.

There's more than enough science to validate that 85-90% of those dhu fish won't survive after release regardless of raising them up slow, using a release weight and if they look good, almost all dhus I fillet have burst a blood vessel in the upper shoulder area externally they look great, internally they are beyond rooted.

I only ever fish with one other so a boat limit of 4 demersals, on average I have to raise 14 dhu fish to get our combined bag limit of 2 dhus and 2 other demersals (pink/blackarse/baldie). I haven't not bagged out in over 4 years showing consistency and strength in the demersal stocks.

statistically based on proven science by fisheries research 10 out of the 12 (85% mortality rate) dhu fish I have to release will not survive.

To come home with our bag of 2 dhus and 2 other demersals I am killing and removing 12 dhu fish (including the 2 in our bag limit, 10 that won't survive) from the fishery

increase the boat limit to 4 dhu fish and bag limit to 2 dhu fish and statistically I will come home with 4 dhu fish.

so kill and remove 4 dhu fish from the fishery per trip or keep going with how things are now and I keep killing and removing 12 dhus per trip to get my bag.

You don't need to be a scientist to see what is the better option of the two.

 

but fisheries will never do it because increasing limits looks bad.

Bag limits are meant to be based on sustainability of the fishery, increasing the boat limit to 4 and bag limit to 2 for dhu fish is by far more sustainable.

 

On the topic of the demersal closure, for the mad keen fisho it really just shifts the fishing pressure and will have an effect down the track on south coast stocks.

the dhu fish stock issue that fisheries are concerned about aren't for the whole west coast zone it's really the direct metro area.

South of mandurah or north of two rocks there's more dhus in the last 4 years than the 4 years prior to that. Can't get away from the bloody things.

if anything increase the closure for the metro area but again it will shift a bit of pressure.

 

My two cents which in today's economy is probably only worth one cent.

 

davewillo's picture

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 I tend to agree with you

Sat, 2021-10-16 10:23

 I tend to agree with you Vic. One time in Jurien when my brother in law was living there and we had the spots dialled in, we caught 22 dhu's to get our two other demersals. Wasn't deep water but I'm sure there were plenty that wouldn't have survived unfortunately.

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wow...igotta pick up my game!

Sat, 2021-10-16 10:32

wow...igotta pick up my game! im luxky if i see a dhu at all!...then again i dont get much else either lol!  however i challenge anyone to a wrasse catching comp!!

Tom M's picture

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 Thats a lot of wasted fish

Sat, 2021-10-16 11:06

 Thats a lot of wasted fish to get your bag limit.

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Tom M

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 Exactly the point I am

Sat, 2021-10-16 11:20

 Exactly the point I am trying to make, it is unsustainable.

rob90's picture

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 The way it sounds your just

Sat, 2021-10-16 13:56

 The way it sounds your just not fishing sustainably. Don't try plead your case to fisheries as you have above it will feck it for all of us. Just my 2cents

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Make the boat limit 4 dhus

Sat, 2021-10-16 16:10

.

 

flangies's picture

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Wouldn't you just get your

Sun, 2021-10-17 21:14

Wouldn't you just get your boat limit of 4 and then keep fishing for other demersals? 

scotto's picture

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no

Tue, 2021-10-19 09:57

 he stated above that he only fishes with one other guy/ 2pob. once he hits 4 dhuies, thats his entire demersal limit for the day. 

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correct 4 drops, 4 dhus and i

Wed, 2021-10-20 19:32

correct 4 drops, 4 dhus and i would happily pull up the lines and spend the rest of the day sounding around, i honestly get pissed if i hookanother dhu and often do nothing in the hope it gets off down on the bottom, i give them every chance to get off or i will lock up but leave the fish on the bottom to make a hole to assist with the hook coming out and getting off.

no one is spending hundreds in fuel for the boat and car plus bait to catch 2 dhus to split between the fishers, be cheaper to go to the market.

i know of a couple of poachers on this site and its quite hillarious to sit back and watch them play innocent when what i am doing isn't illegal. 

I am happy to be made out as the bad guy as apparently i am the only guy in the world that lands his daily bag limit of fish, all the hundreds of other boats floating around all day in the 40's must be fishing whiting.................................

if a boat has bagged out then it well and truly raised more than 2 dhu fish if they are fishing an hour or more either side out of Perth.

 

Pete F's picture

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 Heaps of baldies on the

Fri, 2021-10-22 08:47

 Heaps of baldies on the flats around lano easy to get a bag without hammering the dhu. I have good dhu spots but move off the heavy ground once a bag is met. 

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 Cheers

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Cause for concern

Sat, 2021-10-16 14:26

Understand your argument, but if I was likely killing that many dhu just to reach a bag limit of 2 demersals, I would be having some serious ethical conversations with myself. If it is not possible to avoid catching dhu when you are after  something different for that second demersal, by changing methods or location, then the solution is to just take one dhu each and call it a day. That might be what has to be legislated eventually, if what you describe is the normal scenario for recfishers.  Basically the rules might have to end up along the lines of bag limit being two demersals unless you have a dhu, in which case your demersal bag limit drops to 1. Sure, we'd  often be working hard to catch something other than a dhu first up, but at the end of the day we'd know our impact  was much less.

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i agree.on the occasions that

Sat, 2021-10-16 14:32

i agree.

on the occasions that we do end up with 2 dhus first, we pull the plug and just start trolling or fish for herring, whiting, squid etc.. usally a dhu each is more than enough for a feed with some lft ovr, and makes us do something different for a change.

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 Dropping the bag limit will

Sat, 2021-10-16 15:29

 Dropping the bag limit will result in people continuing to fish and upsizing.

 

I would say less than 5% of guys would be willing to go home after one drop.

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Maybe so, but

Sat, 2021-10-16 15:59

 Hard to know. Upsizing raises similar ethical issues. Most guys would likely know it was not the right thing to do, even when they do it and I'm sure we've all been tempted. So if the culture stays like that  and these fish stocks really are going backwards, the future could well involve much more enforcement on the water for compliance, the 5 month demersal ban etc etc. I'd rather avoid all of that.

Bodie's picture

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 VIC DORY i hear your point

Sat, 2021-10-16 19:26

 VIC DORY i hear your point and actually makes sense.  We often find the same issue, where dhu fish are generally in higher numbers than other species (with exception of pan sized pinks).

 

I do have to ask though, if you're finding it very easy to find and catch dhu fish, i would think you would be able to distinguish the difference betwene dhus and other species on your sounder, i know we do (90% of the time), so there for should be able to limit the number of dhu's you catch after your first 2 are in the esky.

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Every lump I find has dhus on

Sat, 2021-10-16 21:16

Every lump I find has dhus on it, impossible to get away from them.

Seeing dhus fish on the sounder doesn't really come in to how I fish, I find ground, never have searched for fish as such, even with no fish on the sounder I will always drop on a new lump that looks the goods, will always produce fish regardless of whether fish are showing.

I have started dropping my gopro down first drop of each lump and having a look what's on the lump before sending a bait or jig down.

 

if I have 2 dhus and I see a heap of dhus on the gopro I won't drop again I will move and find a new lump and check, it's what I did last Sunday, got a bit groggy in the guts reviewing the gopro footage in the slop.

Water was crystal clear and managed to get some nice footage of dhus, foxies, groper, blackarse and crays.

 

unfortunately relying on not seeing Dhufish on the sounder is far from full proof, the 23kg dhu this year was caught first drop as soon as a tiny bit of bait hit the bottom and the sounder didn't show a single fish on a lump no bigger than 50cm on a medium chirp tranny with 17m of bottom coverage, stuffed if I know where that fish was hiding but goes to show that fish don't always show up, I was actually running a 4/0 with a tiny bit of bait hoping for baldie or a black arse.

 

davewillo's picture

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 Just to clarify my comments

Mon, 2021-10-18 10:50

 Just to clarify my comments above - this was our last fish at Jurien before he moved back to Perth and we had that discussion later that day. Get 2 dhu's on board then switch to something else. We just weren't thinking sensibly.

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Agree

Tue, 2021-10-19 09:37

 

I agree totally with what you are saying,

In the last week before the ban we caught 10 fish and released 10 fish, kept nothing due to all being just undersize. (would have been excellent in the pan)

However when everyone talks about a boat limit, in reality we are fishing for a size limit therfore releasing undersized fish hoping they survive.

I agree we need a boat limit not a size limit.

 

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 Skull

little johnny's picture

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Tackle shops will

Sat, 2021-10-16 10:53

Die. ( if it’s true).

Livewire's picture

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 If it is coming, I hope the

Sat, 2021-10-16 14:05

 If it is coming, I hope the data and research is shown to back it up..... not just a wish list from the greens! I personally am getting fed up with the restrictions put on a outdoor lifestyle.  What was considered a family affair is licensed and bashed from pillar  to post bye oppions of others, to change your way of life. As a group fisherman and hunters are easy target's.

sealure's picture

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Fish Ban

Sat, 2021-10-16 15:29

With stories of people catching & releasing numerous Dhufish just to reach a bag limit is it any wonder Fisheries is going to introduce greater restrictions.
If my friend & I catch 2 Dhufish initially we cease bottom fishing in any area we're likely to catch more. We just cannot justify the risk of catching further Dhufish.  

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 To be honest I think people

Sat, 2021-10-16 16:34

 To be honest I think people have no power anymore, corporations and government do as they please.  We are screwed. I really wish I could find another recreational activity that is as satisfying as fishing. Golf just doesn't do it for me. 

If the powers that be could shows us the scientific data backing up their decisions I wouldn't feel so ripped off. I can already picture the bullshit wreckfish and fisheries are going to say.

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.

Sat, 2021-10-16 16:31

BASE jumping ? 

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 Tried it off my roof once

Sat, 2021-10-16 16:35

 Tried it off my roof once with no parachute tho

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Bodie's picture

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 I dont see a 5 month closure

Sat, 2021-10-16 19:28

 I dont see a 5 month closure being sustainabnle for the loss of revenue to all other businesses, sectors.

 

They would need a pretty credible amount of scientific data to warrant such a significant change, and nothing I've seen points to that, if anything the demersal numbers have improved.

hezzy's picture

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i think all recs should

Sat, 2021-10-16 19:57

i think all recs should expect there to be more restrictions on demersals

likly an extended ban period or they may break it into seperate ban periods, \\\not surprising this is going to happen

while i dont particularly agree with that scenario , just check out the social media dhuie vids to see how many blokes think it ok to catch and release them on masse and like sealure we stop if we get out two dhuies early ,, we go home early , or change to trolling etc ,,

since the last big change in 2008 have a think about the electronics on boats nowdays , size of the boats, weather forecasting , side scan 3d sea mapping etc , its not surprising recs are catching lots of dhuies, we are finding them easier to target ,

we know some recs with upwards of 50k electrics on their boats, now nothing wrong with that all fine ,, , but its just making it easier and easier to target demersals with blokes doing it very regularly every week etc

hopefully it wont end up like marron season or duck hunting ,,

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little johnny's picture

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If your lucky enough to

Sat, 2021-10-16 21:23

Get dhues straight up . And weather good nothing wrong with cutting big rigs off ,swap with Little double or single hooks with 20 to 30 lb leaders for black ass/kgs baldies . Can easy snap line if you want . I always re tie after a days fishing anyway .this could be hear say ( no truth in it) time will tell . 50 gran on electronics . I must admit never seen it on amature boat . Be pretty impressive stuff. I would say gps accuracy biggest weapon now days . Many years ago only use to be compass reading for so many hours/minutes. Then when close turn on paper sounder . No one wanted to waste paper . ( ex pro) who started me into fishing for dhues ect . Plenty of other things to do if it is true .

Bodie's picture

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 we do this with jigging.

Sat, 2021-10-16 22:16

 we do this with jigging. once two dhus are onboard, jigs go away unless chasing sambos in the deep, out comes to KG gear

Belly Fish's picture

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See your point Vic Dory

Sat, 2021-10-16 22:27

And I have some sympathy for your bag limit recommendation, but....

Most of the better fisherman I know have multiple spots....ones where there are mostly Dhus and others where there are mostly Baldies/Breaksea etc.

When we get 2 Dhus early, we move to the other spots and downsize hooks/baits considerably.  Yes, we still do catch the occasional Dhu, but it rarely takes long to round out the bag with other demersals.

It's not responsible to be catching 14 Dhus (which is what you mention) to round out your bag

 

 

sea-kem's picture

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 As others have said if we

Sun, 2021-10-17 09:13

 As others have said if we nail Dhuies early then we target ground with smaller gear that I know mainly holds Baldies. But I have a strong belief of one Dhuie per fisher per boat. As I've argued before even an 8m plus boat you're not going to usually take more than 4 blokes to fish comfortably. 

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Brock O's picture

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I recon fisheries would be

Sun, 2021-10-17 10:55

I recon fisheries would be more concerned about the large population of fishos in a concentrated area compared to the minor % of guys catching and releasing all day.

No way they could drop the catch limits any lower...How do you help a demersal fish with such a low survival rate after capture.

I believe in the science on spawning etc, not sure how they correctly put a number on catch figures for the recreational sector....maybe thats next.

Some of the work on spawning, catch and release data released in 2009 http://www.fish.wa.gov.au/documents/research_reports/frr187.pdf

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 Agree 100 percent with you

Mon, 2021-10-18 10:44

 Agree 100 percent with you mate, some areas dhufish are popping which have never before. It comes down to what areas have been worked over by the larger population. For example in Geograph bay I have close to 4000 individual coral lumps with I have spent the best part of the last 4 years looking for. I can got to 90 percent of them and they will have dhufish, bald chin groper etc. some cases there's even schools of 30-40 dhus sitting on them. The blanket approach on the larger population of regions is never going to work. Breaking the regions in to metro, peel etc and having teams focusing on each industry would yeild more concrete consistent data. Like I said I'm all for science, implementing techniques and methods so the iconic species doesn't just become a story. 

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I don't have a problem with

Sun, 2021-10-17 14:45

I don't have a problem with it. As long as it is across the board. 5 months demersal ban is approx 40% of the year. 

As long as this corresponds with a 40% drop in commercial quota and all these changes are backed by science I think we all should be for it. 

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Rumor or fact ??

Sun, 2021-10-17 17:11

 I usually keep quiet on these topics but does anyone have any factual dates / links to these closures or is this just another social media rumor or a " mate heard this " ??? 

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Harvest strategy repercussion

Sun, 2021-10-17 18:53

i wrote about this 12 months ago after sitting on the harvest strategy group. Very few shits were given. I tried to copy and paste the article here but didn’t work for some reason. There is a lot of misinformation in this thread . But there is also a few good examples of why a ban seems to be the only way forward. It seems tough for some people to self regulate. But I also acknowledge we are all part of the problem. If anyone has any legit info rather than rumour send me a pm. Jamie 

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This is the article from beginning of the year

Sun, 2021-10-17 18:56

And will help explain the situation. Again if anyone knows anything concrete I’m keen to know.

​Very little is simple in fisheries management but the latest thing I’ve been involved in really is a can of worms. A rather important can of worms, mind you, for everyone reading this so I will try and disentangle it for you.
​Over the last few months I’ve been part of the West Coast Demersal Harvest Strategy working group.
​Now a harvest strategy is a document that establishes the decision rules that determine the appropriate harvest levels for all sectors of a fishery in order to meet the ecological, economic and social objectives established for a resource. The resource in this case being west coast demersals – which to complicate things consists of a varied collection of different species such as baldchin groper, pink snapper, dhufish, breaksea cod, harlequin, red throat emperor etc - all of which have different life cycles and habitat preferences and differing levels of importance to recreational and commercials.
​A harvest strategy seeks to set out plainly what levels the stocks should exist at in reference to what the virgin biomass was and what needs to happen should that stock fall below pre agreed levels.
​By pre agreed levels we are talking about levels that usually equate to 20% (at which point extreme action of catch reductions of between 50-100% should occur), 30% at which point some action should be taken (10-50% reductions) and 50%, which is usually the level at which everything is considered A-OK.
​ I might point out that it is a pretty sad situation in my opinion that we see 50% of virgin biomass to be the pinnacle of achievement in terms of stock health, but that’s humanity for you. My biggest contribution in the working group was to set this at 50% rather than 40%, which was the original proposal. My opinion is that 50% is the bare minimum we should use. For the time being however it is only a dream. We are way below this level currently.
​Now the beauty of a harvest strategy is that while it determines what should happen in terms of management if a stock falls below certain levels it doesn’t determine how that should happen.
​Now this is good because it gives transparency to the decisions being made in terms of management and why they are happening but the cynical bastard part of me also feels that it is a handy separation between management objectives and management actions.
​For example if you needed to reduce catch rates by 50% it would probably make some people mighty sore – even if it was for the best. However those making that decision can just say “We are just following the harvest strategy so don’t blame us!” while the people that came up with the harvest strategy can just say “Don’t blame us – we didn’t say how you should reduce catches!” Which is a lovely bit of bureaucratic circle work.
​This is not the intention of a harvest strategy of course – but it is perhaps a handy consequence for those having to make decisions that are bound to piss people off. Maybe it’s even a good thing because for so long management has moved at the a very slow rate because it’s easier to do nothing than something. And this is what collapses fisheries.
​So this harvest strategy isn’t about saying we need longer closed seasons or tags or anything else. I fielded quite a few phone calls from people during this process because it had got out on the grapevine that it was. But it is worth considering what might happen in the future.
​To do this let’s look at the current situation. In 2007 the decision was made that we had to halve demersal take across the board because things were getting out of control. The upshot of this was that a total allowable catch was introduced of 700 tonnes, and under IFM this was split into 450t commercial and 250t recreational.
​Being a multi-species fishery it is further complicated because different species have different “guides” in terms of allocation between sectors. Dhufish are split 60/40 in favour of recs while pink snapper are split 20/80 and red throat emperor 10/90.
​And because of this multi-species nature only certain species are used in terms of examining the stock health and fishing pressure. In the harvest strategy proposal this will be dhufish and pink snapper across the whole area and will also include baldchin groper in the mid-west.
​So where are we currently in terms of catch levels and stock assessment?
​Well for the last five years the commercial sector has failed to catch its share (indeed it has dropped to about half of its 450 tonnes at 244 tonnes) while the rec sector has exceeded its 250 tonne limit by catching 293 tonnes. Nothing has happened however because when combined the total has been below the 700 tonnes aggregate allowable catch.
​But should we require a 50% reduction then it means the rec sector will have to drop its catch by MORE than 50% to 125 tonnes while the commercial sector will have to do virtually nothing. Interesting situation huh?
​​There are currently 125 000 recreational boat fishing licenses. If 100 000 access the west coast that means at 125 tonnes that 1.25kilos whole weight of fish (one small baldchin for example) is allowed per license per year. Of course it’s not that simple. Most licenses aren’t used for targeting demersals (we think). But I caught about 25 kilos of fish in the west coast last year which is the allowance for 20 licenses at this level.
​And what if we start adding in release mortality and shark depredation to the rec sector take? Already 59% of dhufish we catch are released and 50% probably die. Around shark infested places like the Abrolhos, release mortality and shark depredation probably increase our actual “take” by 50%.
​So maybe ask yourself how we could go about reducing our catch by 50% in a multi-species fishery with no accurate recording system where release mortality is a real issue?
​So what are the latest stock assessments telling us? Well they are not good with maybe some slight recovery in the metro area but north of that stocks appear to be struggling. And we are not far off the trigger levels being discussed in the current harvest strategy. The best indication is of course the commercial sector because they are not trying to not catch their share – they just can’t due to a lack of fish.
​Now I have been told I’m a bit too worried about the state of demersal stocks but I will promise you in the last five years I’ve seen fish numbers become much thinner on the ground in much of the areas I fish on the west coast. And most people I know realise that something is going to have to happen soon.
​I’m a writer so I like a good metaphor. Picture that this harvest strategy is the fan. The next stock assessment, or perhaps the one after that, is likely to be a pile of excrement that will get thrown at this fan. I’m not sure about this of course but my feeling is that’s the most likely scenario.
​But at least we have some transparency and defined objectives now. And that’s a good thing.
END

Tim's picture

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Quota

Sun, 2021-10-17 19:18

Thanks Jamie. There has been a lot of discussion lately not only in WA but all over Aus from proffesional groups and talking up the need for a proper measurement of the rec take vs allocated quota.

Do you think this is a model they could go down to manage the rec take eg your license purchase allows you to catch X number of each demersal species?

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Yes and no

Sun, 2021-10-17 19:26

i pushed for this when I was on the board of rfw. There was nothing but negativity about it. Imo it would have been a proactive step. Everything is reactive. It’s ridiculous. Like an endless loop. But maybe with apps etc this might be what happens. But just remember we currently are allowed on a per license level 2.5 kilos whole weight of demersals per year. Now drop that to 1.25kg. Then we get people unable to stop fishing if they don’t get their bag limits and keep killing or at least potentially killing dhuies. It’s almost an impossible situation. A ban extension or possibly buying out the pros with our license money seems more likely.  

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 Thanks Jamie. Great to see

Sun, 2021-10-17 19:35

 Thanks Jamie. Great to see actual figures. Even with a fair bit of digging nothing is usually as transparent as what you have just posted. 

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Yeah no probs mate. Glad you

Sun, 2021-10-17 19:46

Yeah no probs mate. Glad you appreciated it. It’s complicated hey 

K_willo's picture

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 Great bit of reading Jamie,

Mon, 2021-10-18 05:28

 Great bit of reading Jamie, thanks for posting. Food for thought.

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After an indepth

Mon, 2021-10-18 18:42

read of your post jamie, it appears the issue is within the Shark infested areas, one would be led to believe...if this is the case, a ban/closure across the whole region would be quite unreasonable, one would think.

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Hence why I asked

Sun, 2021-10-17 19:26

Question . Obviously no one has . I thought someone on here may have some facts.

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Thanks for post and its good

Mon, 2021-10-18 05:47

Thanks for post and its good to hear from someone who knows their stuff.  

To me it just seems like guesswork tho. Maybe they need to place separate regulations for each type of demersal species. Is there really a shortage of baldies compared to dhuies. Pinkies imo are doing great with good numbers of all sizes.

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Yeah people imo shouldn’t be

Mon, 2021-10-18 09:05

Yeah people imo shouldn’t be kidding themselves about dhuie stocks. People view the numbers of small dhuies out there as healthy. But it’s also a warning sign that the stock is over fished. We are sitting at about 20% virgin biomass they reckon. I don’t view that as healthy at all. 

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Is there any science behind

Mon, 2021-10-18 10:10

Is there any science behind that 20% virgin biomass figure Jamie?  How do they come up with that figure? 

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Several ways that are

Tue, 2021-10-19 09:31

Several ways that are combined to form an overall view. It’s a best estimate scenario. Read the harvest strategy if you’re really curious. 

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Harvesting Stategy

Wed, 2021-10-20 08:03

is only as good as who/m logs in their catches......explain why the FD in their wisdom has given a net boat a ticket to wet line demersals whilst the net is set....is this another management strategy to help deplete the stocks.

Maybe a Maximum size limit on Dhufish would be a better option like the 80cm maximum Barramundi size limit to deter many egos.

 

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 I agree with Jamie to some

Mon, 2021-10-18 10:20

 I agree with Jamie to some extent, if you are given a bay limit you will aim to get it. With the costs of fuel, the time on the water etc. I myself do mammoth amounts of km looking for new ground to farm spots. Either drop the limit to one demersal per person and remove the dhu fish boat limit of 2 dhus per person with limits as is. From freediving i can't tell in my area geo bay the dhu sigh life has sky rocketed, before the ban was introduce I had never seen a dhufish whilst shore diving. Now I'm likely to see 6 or so during the dive same area and same time of year. Where I'm going with this is different areas have different pressure from population etc. more zoning to break up the areas would be more benificail and allow a better idea of what area is actually being fished. Hence change the bans to suit the pressure on that area. If a 5 month ban comes into play they are going to have to have to a think about how they structure it. With COVID 19 and lack of travel going on fishing brings massive revenue to the local south businesses. In term will see more and more shut up shop. I'm all for sustainable fishing for the further as long as the science backs it up. 

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Adding to my other comment,

Mon, 2021-10-18 10:32

Adding to my other comment, It Would also be nice to have another option during this 5 month ban, why not allow deep dropping to happen during the ban?? Don't think I have seen or heard of a dhufish getting caught in 220m of water. The serious angler who has the boat and electronics can go target something different. Leaving the smaller inshore boats to be able to target bread and butter species.  With no other options during 5 month there is going to be a massive strain put on other species and not to mention crew flocking to other regions. It's somewhat moving the problem to another area. A three month ban would be aggreable but nearly half the year seems a bit rough with no other avenues.

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 Nice idea this one, only

Mon, 2021-10-18 12:23

 Nice idea this one, only exception is its very common to pull up pinky's from the depths, how to combat that.

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 Frying pan on board 

Mon, 2021-10-18 12:25

 Frying pan on board 

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Zones

Mon, 2021-10-18 13:04

 Breaking the areas up into Zones won't work.

Now it is common to hook up the boat and travel from south of the river and launch at 2 Rocks or even as far as Lancelin or Jurien for a days fishing, same goes for down here in Bunbury, I remember travelling from here and lauching at Old Dunsborough and Canal rocks for a days fishing, nothing has changed since then

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 Very true John, we've been

Mon, 2021-10-18 13:25

 Very true John, we've been seeing more and more 'bigger' boats heading our way for day trips as these bigger boys don't mind smashing into the sou wester to get home knowing it's not metro hammered. 

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Very true

Mon, 2021-10-18 18:44

many, including myself head south and even up to Dawesville to virtually unmolested waters...Many go right down to the South coast....

 

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Deep Drop

Mon, 2021-10-18 18:41

Just adds more issues Kyle.

Some of the deep drop species are slower growing than Dhu so alot of damage can be done.

You can also see a lot of localized depletion of fish in an area when spots get shared around.

Being able to move effort would be great but it is hard to manage.

Might need more people eating pelagics.

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 Start knocking fillets off

Mon, 2021-10-18 19:21

 Start knocking fillets off marlin

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Million Dollar Whaler would

Thu, 2021-10-21 11:16

Million Dollar Whaler would also help

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rec fishers can also expect

Mon, 2021-10-18 12:28

rec fishers can also expect to see an increase in the ability to record their catches .

currently fisheries are revamping their online digital platform ,according to one of their senior officers i spoke with recently at our meeting in sept part of its new capability will be to have incorporated a rec app for logging catches online before your boat comes out of the water after a days fishing , that will not initially be compulsory ,their planning to trial it at the abrolhos islands for recs in the near future , if trialed and the issues are in the main ironed out , feedback worked on etc you would expect over a decade it will be likely mandated to provide up to the day accurate figures of rec catches in each of the zones for any rec licenced boat fishers

that will provide much greater detail on who is catching what , when and where, that hard evidence would then be used to drive management changes as needed ,

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 That would be the go

Mon, 2021-10-18 14:41

 That would be the go invaluable information straight from the source. Also great for recs to monitor the catches. Then there's no disputing the data because it's there.

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wellthing is kyle , on one

Mon, 2021-10-18 19:44

wellthing is kyle , on one hand it would be providing good catch figures for recs if they can get it up and runnign

but like all good ideas ,logging your catch on a phone app sounds great and easy ,,hard not to like and agree with that off the bat ,, its in the detail and how its implemented

things that might crop up

1 would it be compulsory like tail clipping crays before landing ??

if so would compliance officers fine you if not done before landing ??

how in depth would the records be on the app ?? licence number of fishers, age , residential address , ramp launched from , boat size, depth fished time on water ,

if fines applied who would wear them if the app record is not correctly done before landing ?/skipper ? boat owner or individual fisher ?/

phone battery goes flat /
forget phone and leave in car at ramp ?

phone gets wet ?what if the info identifying high catch rates for particular fishers or boats then leads to licence limits or quotas per fisher or boat ?/
it could also be used to make a case for tags for demersal per licence and as james has pointed out above that about 2.5kg per fisher if shared across the licences

so many ways this can be applied once the info is available ,,

run out of credit for some phone users not on plans ?/

min /no phone coverage ,like gracetown inside the bay

small boat issues on rainy /wet days ?

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Shithouse attitude

Mon, 2021-10-18 14:17

 Blows my mind that a member on here that fishes for demersals 200+ hours a year (for the last several years), and believes that 90% of dhuies caught and released won't survive, still goes out and catches and releases on average 14 dhuies on top of the 2 kept to fill the rest of the bag! Do the maths guys, the numbers are right there. That's is absolutely disgusting behaviour.  Reading that has pissed me off more than hearing about a 5 month ban. Absolutely shocked. I almost want to screenshot that and forward it to fisheries hoping to get this supposed 5 month ban extended, 1 year,  2 years, indefinitely I couldn't give a shit. Im sure they're reading this thread anyway, good riddance. 

 

Oh and did I say I was disgusted?

 

DISGUSTED!

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How do you really feel?  All

Mon, 2021-10-18 14:29

How do you really feel?

 

 

All those Dhuies and I have never caught one. You're all talking shit.

 

 

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 Mate I don't think I've

Mon, 2021-10-18 15:21

 Mate I don't think I've caught one since that day and that was years ago!

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Not directed at you. The

Mon, 2021-10-18 16:12

Edit* replied to wrong comment sorry

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 Didn't take it that way Beau

Mon, 2021-10-18 17:53

 Didn't take it that way Beau so all good!

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Catch

Mon, 2021-10-18 18:13

and release for the sake of or EGO is a shit house attitude IMHO.....

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Catch and release of certain

Mon, 2021-10-18 18:23

Catch and release of certain species I don't have an issue with, catching and releasing demersals(an average of 14 dhufish!) to fill your bag is not sustainable fishing and to and blame the rules is just piss poor

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 Sadly mate it's probably

Mon, 2021-10-18 18:23

 Sadly mate it's probably widespread. 

I used to have that attitude as the thinking was catch and release was a good thing, but have been educated in the meantime. Very careful now about how we fish, bringing them up as slow as possible. And changing ground for other species. 

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Well said!... Selfish and

Tue, 2021-10-19 09:07

Well said!... Selfish and entitled beyond belief. Genuinely disgusting behaviour.

 

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You’re not the only one

Tue, 2021-10-19 09:58

You’re not the only one thinking this i can assure you. 

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Worth a read

Tue, 2021-10-19 12:59

Did you have a read of the report  that BrockO pasted the link to. Some good reading.

http://www.fish.wa.gov.au/documents/research_reports/frr187.pdf.

p48 Rec anglers found a big school of dhuies in Geographe Bay in 2005. Est to contain 200 fish. Visited it on 8 occassions  over a 4 month period...before the fish moved on. Read between the lines...we flogged the piss out of it every 2 weeks until we fuc&ed it.

I have been guilty myself.  Catching and releasing dhuies. Jesus a different times of the years they are pretty easy to find. I do it for the fun more so than to fill the freezer. Travel for 2 hours to get to an area. A long way to go for one drop. I am getting better with age and wisdom. 

Have a look at p51/52 of the report and some of the aggregation sizes. WOW. They are still out there, but once found and with todays technology they cop a flogging. Guys posting on social media how good they are...where in actual fact they are flogging one spot until it is cactus. 

What about pro's. Can't see how pro's have a future targeting dhuies. Have a look at p51 again. 900kg caught (guessing 180 dhuies), 145 caught, 113 caught etc etc. Surely tp make a buck they have to target aggregations.

Ktreloar...great you have 4000 spots full of dhuies...but I would be keeping it to myself if pro's can fish the area. Might have been a good recruitment 10 years ago. Once gone.....

I personally think an extended ban is the only way to go to protect dhuies.

 

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My spots get protected by the

Tue, 2021-10-19 16:13

My spots get protected by the dreaded algae bloom which chokes the everything. Over the summer periods you will just stare at your screen wondering if it's broken. Then I usually don the freediving gear ok and go for a look. I agree something needs to be done. But as a whole not just one sector. 

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Everything turns into a war

Mon, 2021-10-18 14:47

Simple question . No malice meant . Far out ..

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Lets HOPE

Mon, 2021-10-18 17:19

this "Proposed closure/Ban" is across the board.....seems really pointless the Recs stop and the Indiscriminates continue and bare in mind, I did hear that a Net boat has a wet line licence so they can continue to fish the stocks whilst the net is set.....................Maybe a continuation of the Metro area that has NO net pressure be continued parallel to the Cape Naturaliste encompassing the Whole bay out to the 200m line....this in itself would help preserve thje stocks..

 

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I wish not being able to

Mon, 2021-10-18 18:14

I wish not being able to escape dhus was a problem I had 

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 If they bring a 5 month ban

Tue, 2021-10-19 08:26

 If they bring a 5 month ban in ,ill sell my boat and gear. With work , family and bad weather i have only managed to get out 3 or 4 times in the last 18 months. Maybe buy a Hobie and float around the rivers.

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 Simple facts  more boats on

Tue, 2021-10-19 09:02

 Simple facts  more boats on the water, more people fishing,  more fish being caught, more fish being upgraded for bigger fish, more unethical fishermen. More F##k heads.

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 5 month ban can get in the

Tue, 2021-10-19 09:07

 5 month ban can get in the bin. 

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October to March targets?

Tue, 2021-10-19 09:33

 So,  always good to plan ahead. In a scenario with no demersals  October through March I could see myself with plenty to do, despite no tasty trophy demersals. Chasing tailor a bit more often and mucking around with light gear and new lures, experimenting with herring and methods to stop so many jumping off, learning to harvest cephs like some of the legends on this forum and burleying up  skippy even though the bigger ones seem more a winter thing. There's also  flcking poppers and plastics for whiting, flatties and other river species. Then of course, the cray run ahead of the summer pelagics, with Yellowtail kings, tuna and spaniards all a chance etc etc. I do catch the occasional demersal and greatly enjoy the resulting meals, but for me there would still be plenty of options for fun, food and joyous days on the water. An extended closure wouldn't be the end off the world.

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October to March Ban

Tue, 2021-10-19 13:02

Will kill tourism in some country towns.   Think Greenhead, Cervantes, Jurien etc.

Sure, some people go there who don't fish or don't fish for Demersals, but I think this would be a disaster  

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 Like wise south through

Tue, 2021-10-19 16:14

 Like wise south through Augusta, with COVID stopping tourism this would be another blow.

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Tourists or freezer fillers?

Tue, 2021-10-19 17:00

Not everyone wants tourism in these small towns, we don't need it. Apparently their are some that will catch 14 Dhu for a bag of 2, fuck that, stay away please, a day trip from Perth to harvest our stocks because yours are dwindling reminds me of the Chinese fleets raping the waters all over the globe.

I dont have a problem with tourists, have travelled a fair bit myself, but I do have a concern with freezer fillers from nearby citys.

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your stocks? last time

Wed, 2021-10-20 19:11

your stocks? last time checked it was a WA resource, might have to head your way to catch your so called stocks.