Offshore wind forecast up to twice as strong as on land
Submitted by jgfisho on Tue, 2017-08-22 14:17
Hi,
This new video shows how the offshore wind forecast can be up to twice as strong as it is at the shoreline. Interesting watch for any fisho and the reason why the checking the forecast at the shore/boat ramp is not a good idea and the reason people get caught out sometimes. You should be checking the wind forecast offshore where you intend on fishing.
Joe
Walfootrot
Posts: 1386
Date Joined: 23/07/12
That's why I look at Rotto on
That's why I look at Rotto on seabreeze, gives a good indication.
More drum lines, kill the bloody sharks!
dodgy
Posts: 4563
Date Joined: 01/02/10
Nearly got caught out last
Nearly got caught out last week. Was going to do a quick overnighter to montes as the Dampier forcast was under 10 knots all day. Montes was showing 25 and turned out the guys already over there just sat in the anchorage all day.
Does anyone know where the love of god goes, when the waves turn the minutes to hours?
southpoint
Posts: 47
Date Joined: 30/03/11
Elders
Check out the Elders offshore marine forecast. Its extrememly accurate and gives a much better picture if you are venturing out wider
Mulie
Posts: 546
Date Joined: 20/02/11
Meteye on the BOM site tends
Meteye on the BOM site tends to be ok.
Mulie
Marineboy
Posts: 839
Date Joined: 14/03/14
Windyty
windyty allows you to pin point the area you intend to fish and yes it is generally stronger wind out wide than in close.
My spots are so secret even the fish don't know about them !
jgfisho
Posts: 59
Date Joined: 15/03/17
Windyty doesn't use BoM
Windyty doesn't use BoM data, it uses the GFS model from America (or if you change default the EC model from Europe). Look in the bottom right corner of screen it will tell you. Both of these perform worse than BoM data (else why would the government fund BoM to exist if they couldn't forecast better than an iverseas agency who offer data free on the internet?)
Marineboy
Posts: 839
Date Joined: 14/03/14
Windyty
hey jgfisho regardless of where the data is sourced in my experience they give a pretty good wind forecast.
My spots are so secret even the fish don't know about them !
Swompa
Posts: 3783
Date Joined: 14/10/12
MetEye for forecast,
MetEye for forecast, Seabreeze for observations.
jgfisho
Posts: 59
Date Joined: 15/03/17
Hi Swompa,Why wouldn't you
Hi Swompa,
Why wouldn't you just use Fish Ranger then? Fish Ranger uses same data as MetEye and same observations as Seabreeze (Seabreeze just get it from BoM weather stations like anyone else).
So you can go to one site and get the exact same data you get now, on the one page.
Joe
Swompa
Posts: 3783
Date Joined: 14/10/12
Because my memory is shit and
Because my memory is shit and I am a creature of habit.
jgfisho
Posts: 59
Date Joined: 15/03/17
MetEye and Fish Ranger use
MetEye and Fish Ranger use the same data (ie the exact same values) its just an easier way to see the week ahead that navigating to MetEye on a mobile and time stepping through to the right day then drilling down to a point to get a forecast.
z00m
Posts: 1086
Date Joined: 10/05/14
Same as swompa
I also use meteye for the forecast, willy or seabreeze for the obs, and tides4fishing for the solunar charts. All that means I usually go out and end up in crap weather not forecast and couldn't catch a fish to save my life! ha ha
meglodon
Posts: 5981
Date Joined: 17/06/10
Right on
Yep I know exactly where you are coming from.
gruntre69
Posts: 533
Date Joined: 15/10/16
I'm converted to Fishranger
I'm converted to Fishranger too. I use Rottnest for metro offshore but I do know that the live and historic data fro Rottnest is about 3-5 Kn high due to the position of the anemometer especially southerly. The wind funels up the hill and amplifies the reading slightly.
Marine trimmer NOR (available for clears, tops, carpet, upholstery, custom equipment covers)
Jackfrost80
Posts: 8048
Date Joined: 07/05/12
I love Fishranger especially
I love Fishranger especially since I know I can now add my own locations
Officially off the Pies bandwagon
gruntre69
Posts: 533
Date Joined: 15/10/16
yep x2
yep x2
Marine trimmer NOR (available for clears, tops, carpet, upholstery, custom equipment covers)
dano83
Posts: 790
Date Joined: 25/05/12
Yer used fishranger at dhi
Yer used fishranger at dhi put in a few locations and they were pretty much spot on
z00m
Posts: 1086
Date Joined: 10/05/14
Sponsor
I'd probably use fishranger if they were a site sponsor and not just randomly plugging their wares.
kirky79
Posts: 1351
Date Joined: 13/01/12
Spot on
gruntre69
Posts: 533
Date Joined: 15/10/16
I don't understand this.
I don't understand this. It's a totally free service and a free APP. He might gain something from advertisers if he can get enough web traffif but Hat off to him from me for having a go and producing an awesome free tool for all to use...
Marine trimmer NOR (available for clears, tops, carpet, upholstery, custom equipment covers)
carnarvonite
Posts: 8627
Date Joined: 24/07/07
Seabreeze / Meteye
Saebreeze as a quick reference then Meteye for greater detail.
Can't see myself reinventing the wheel and changing away from something that works
jgfisho
Posts: 59
Date Joined: 15/03/17
Fair comments guys. Fish
Fair comments guys. Fish Ranger would love to sponsor the forum, unfortunatley we are looking down the barrel of shutting down because many people are used to othe sites and reluctant to change, and we don't have enough numbers to get sponsors on board. We convinced Rapala to advertise on a wether site then when push come to shove they ditched us and started a campain with Willyweather. Even though Willyweather's users cross the general public probably moreso than fishermen.
After spending hundreds of $k to get the site built and $2k per month for data and servers, all for not a single dollar back (ok advertising on the site makes about $30c per day), sponsoring other sites is not possible. Continuing to operate as we are is not sustainable either.
gruntre69
Posts: 533
Date Joined: 15/10/16
See my comment above mate, I
See my comment above mate, I hope it gets better. I'd hate to loose it, very good site and I know how hard it can be to get web traffic.
I for one will put a post on Facebook to try and help you.
Marine trimmer NOR (available for clears, tops, carpet, upholstery, custom equipment covers)
jgfisho
Posts: 59
Date Joined: 15/03/17
Gruntree thanks for the
Gruntree thanks for the support it is greatly appreciated.
Sorry for the late reply I've been on holiday.
crano
Posts: 695
Date Joined: 04/11/09
Shame
Really sorry to hear that as it is a great site.
Worst part is seeing someone putting in lots of time and money for no reward.
I things turn around for you.
scottnofish
Posts: 1617
Date Joined: 28/08/07
been using fish ranger alot latley
they are pretty spot on for all the offshore spots like the fads.leeman offshore. coral bay south and I really like how it can look back at the past week to show how the forecast and actual winds were .only thing missing is fish feeding times ,other than that it has everything in the 1 app
jgfisho
Posts: 59
Date Joined: 15/03/17
Hi Scottnofish, When you go
Hi Scottnofish,
When you go to the Past Weather page you are seeing measurements taken by BoM's network of weather stations that we store indefinately. The past weather page recalls data from the past week and puts it in a chart.
If you click the little (i) next to the chart title it will tell you which weather station meaured it. Similarly on the forecast charts if you click the (i) it will give you all the details relevant to it and where the real time was measured.
Joe
unhurry
Posts: 236
Date Joined: 23/10/12
i like
I have had a look at the site and there is much to like.
I have downloaded the app too.
Well done and thank you for developing this resource!
jgfisho
Posts: 59
Date Joined: 15/03/17
Thank you unhurry. It's
Thank you unhurry. It's been a labour of passion to get it to this point.
Woodsy65
Posts: 162
Date Joined: 21/05/15
I have become a little
I have become a little "gun-shy" when it comes to the weather forecast as every time I think it will be good, it turns out to be crap! Starting to get a complex!
So after checking Sea Breeze, Willy Weather, BOM and Fish Ranger, I have concluded that tomorrow off Mandurah will be a good day to get out.
Would anyone like to confirm my thoughts or shatter my hopes?
Cheers
timboon
Posts: 2924
Date Joined: 14/11/10
Yo Merman..... I'll call you
Yo Merman.....
I'll call you out mate and ask you to inform us as to how you come to the conclusion that "winds" are usually stronger offshore??
I think you are giving it a good old squeeze again....
I mean its pretty fucking obvious that if the wind is blowing in the East and you travel in a Westerly direction as you move away from the coast the wind be blowing harder in unprotected waters BUT to generalise and state that winds blow stronger offshore is a load of Jizz.....
I'll go so far as to say the opposite, and that "winds" are often lighter than what they are compared to inshore waters...
Marineboy
Posts: 839
Date Joined: 14/03/14
Timboon
these observations come from experience, unlike yourself I regularly fish 20 plus miles offshore.
Also check sites like windyty and MetEye and you will see the difference between inshore and out wide, oh and timboon both these sites have pictures so even you will understand them.
My spots are so secret even the fish don't know about them !
jgfisho
Posts: 59
Date Joined: 15/03/17
Timboon,Wind that blows over
Timboon,
Wind that blows over land encounters more friction so the surface wind speeds are (relatively) low. When wind blows over water the surface friction is less so surface wind speeds are higher. Have a look at the article: www.fishranger.com.au/the_truth_about_weather_sites
specifically the section titled:
Why is it Important to Use a Weather Site That Provides Forecasts Over Open Water?Joe
Fisher Kid
Posts: 358
Date Joined: 16/10/12
Problem with forecasts, is
Problem with forecasts, is they are forecasts, without an actual wind speed measuring station at the point you are trying to get a forecast for, its just data that is being extrapolated and interpreted from periodically measured data, or from the nearest land station using algorithms etc.
Extrapolation is statistically not particularly accurate. Take the readings as predictions not as truth unless there is a live, minute to minute wind speed measurer there.
Fishing and catching are two different things. But i want to learn how to catch.
terboz123
Posts: 1358
Date Joined: 13/04/11
dude,while i give you props
dude,
while i give you props for promoting safe boating. and to think before hand, but in all seriousness , if skippers arnt already doing what your saying to general point, i wouldnt be crewing on their boat.......
a hard days fishing still beats work
PGFC member
GCGFC membertimboon
Posts: 2924
Date Joined: 14/11/10
Merman, You do understand
Merman,
You do understand how a seabreeze affects INSHORE waters now dont you? You being the legend of the deep will surely have noted that often you actually dont encounter a seabreeze when fishing a long way from the land that has created the sea breeze.
I feel blessed to have the opportunity to converse with a true legend of the ocean like yourself Merman, Wowee, the regular 20 mile man... Unlike myself lolling around...
No you are on the money Merman, i dont ( unfortunately ) fish the legendary 20 mile mark anymore very often, i'm no longer in the commercial fishing industry and in more recent years floating about on Oil Rigs and construction barges miles from land but when i was i was spending half my life out there... I'm actually suprised i didnt see you float on by with some world records hanging out of your chilli bin cuzzi bro.....
I am greatful to have a true waterman like yourself keeping it real and educating us not so wise folk on here.
JGfish i understand the point you are trying to make kinda, sort of.... actually nah i dont...
Are you saying the wind has always got some sort of East wind in it? In confusseded....
Obviously the wind blows from all directions and sure you can apply the friction theory when the wind has some sort of land that can affect it but to make the call that the wind blows stronger offshore is to be honest a total load of shit....
timboon
Posts: 2924
Date Joined: 14/11/10
Just for you
Just for you Merman....
Thanks JGfish, this was uselful to help get my point across to the old seadog Merman....
What Is A Seabreeze?Sea Breezes are caused by the uneven heating of sea and land masses by solar radiation. As the sun rises in the sky, temperatures on land get hotter but temperatures over water don’t change much. This causes air to rise over land which sucks in air from over the ocean and creates an air current. This air current forms a cyclic motion that picks up cool air from the ocean and brings it inland to replace the rising hot air. Seabreezes are strongest right on the coast line as this is where the cyclic air currents have maximum flow.
Given the difference in temperatures increases as the day goes on, seabreezes normally pick up in the afternoon and continue into the evening until the temperature on land has cooled.
Marineboy
Posts: 839
Date Joined: 14/03/14
Drink up timboon
think you've lost the plot, Seabreezes are a very seasonal thing, you are so pig headed you won't even listen to someone who has created a weather app. No seabreeze yesterday and the wind was stronger outside than in close in the morning ! Explain that.
My spots are so secret even the fish don't know about them !
timboon
Posts: 2924
Date Joined: 14/11/10
Oh Merman old chap, so this
Oh Merman old chap, so this topic was a seasonal thing was it?
My apologies, i didnt realise that was the road you were going down, excuse my pig headedness, actually if you'll excuse me i'll have another skoll...
I'm glad you've learnt something though, it just goes to show you can teach an old seadog new tricks...
And FYI, as far as Joe is concerned i'm sure he's a good bloke but just because he's made an app and you now want to tongue his freckle doesn't mean i'll get on all 4's and give you a hand. I'm sure Joe is very knowledgeable HOWEVER, to generalise and state that the winds are often stronger offshore than inshore waters is where i called BULLSHIT....
I've proven my point above, anyway I'm off to make an app, no tonguing my freck though you dirty little boy.....
timboon
Posts: 2924
Date Joined: 14/11/10
Oh and to answer you'r
Oh and to answer you'r question you silly little boy, I stated waaay back in this convo that you dont have to be fucking Einstein to work out that if the wind is blowing off the land which it was yesterday then of course as you leave the inshore PROTECTED waters ( call it fucking friction or whatever the fuck you want to call it ) IT WILL BE STRONGER OFFSHORE.....
Kapish?!?!
Deleted
Posts: 6265
Date Joined: 26/04/14
Ahahahahhahahahaahahahah
Ahahahahhahahahaahahahah good times
jgfisho
Posts: 59
Date Joined: 15/03/17
Hi Timboon,In the process of
Hi Timboon,
In the process of creating a weather app, and in the years of research leading up to it, you do learn a thing or two about weather. I can confidently tell you that wind is definately OFTEN stronger offshore than onshore or at the shoreline and it is due to surface friction. I don't think you actually read the section of article I referenced you to as that explains why.
Don't just take my word on this, here is what maritime safety victoria have to say on the matter.
transportsafety.vic.gov.au/maritime-safety/recreational-vessel-operators/powerboat/trip-preparation/checking-weather-and-tides
Check out the first sentence:
Before you go out on the water, always check the weather using a marine weather forecast. Land and general forecasts do not take into account wind speed over water, which is double that over land.
Now they say it is double that on land, it isn't always double but being a safety organisation they err on the side of caution.
carnarvonite
Posts: 8627
Date Joined: 24/07/07
Cape Naturaliste
Try explain the wind forecast for Cape Naturaliste then. We used to have easterly winds of around 20 knots at the mooring at Canal Rocks yet go 4nm offshore and its flat calm, spoke to BoM duty forecasters from off Naturaliste and they said its was same strength at the lighthouse yet we were in glass conditions, this is a regular occurrence down there, Just ask Reece who is fishing that region now and he will back this up
Bryce Day
Posts: 812
Date Joined: 01/06/15
It did that yesterday. Got
It did that yesterday. Got to the 40m line and it was dead flat. Back in natto it was windy. But it did glass right off until 3am.
natto is bloody hard weather to read.
timboon
Posts: 2924
Date Joined: 14/11/10
Theres an old saying Gilly,
Theres an old saying Gilly, You can lead a drink to water but you cant make him horse
Deleted
Posts: 6265
Date Joined: 26/04/14
gotta hand it to you TB its
gotta hand it to you TB its worth the read when you post, as long as its cold ill drink
Jackfrost80
Posts: 8048
Date Joined: 07/05/12
I'll be your +1 Gilly.Merman
I'll be your +1 Gilly.
Merman really doesn't like The Boon does he. I'm starting to thing that The Boon cut his seagrass and stole his Merlady?
Officially off the Pies bandwagon
timboon
Posts: 2924
Date Joined: 14/11/10
Joe i missed you'r reply
Joe i missed you'r reply initially,
Now Joe....
I really hope you have others aiding your judgement because i think you need it...
I feel somewhat insulted when you tell me ( us ) as fisherman to check the forecast prior to venturing down next to or on the ocean...
I'm on this site for banter but mostly for the opinions and knowledge of alot of the regular posters.....
I still cant agree with your opinion that ( Often ) the winds blow stronger offshore than inshore...
Its again TBH a misleading comment and not needed here, you can show me as many links as you like but i've well and truely formed my own judgement...
Lets also not forget we have members from all over this state/country, you go telling crew from Gerro inshore waters are LESS windy than offshore waters, i think they'll tell you old merman is giving you a good old reach around....
Boon
sea-kem
Posts: 14853
Date Joined: 30/11/09
Reach around
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2vkiLHiTcY
Love the West!
timboon
Posts: 2924
Date Joined: 14/11/10
Thanks for your support Andy
Thanks for your support Andy and Gilly,
Well and Frosty a little bit, but Frosty your comment was also kinda like "hey boon can I please lick your freckle"
I think there is enough Freckle lickers around here....
Hey - How do you know you've got aids?
Usually you feel a short jabbing pain in your rectum......
Jackfrost80
Posts: 8048
Date Joined: 07/05/12
If I wanted a cream filled
If I wanted a cream filled bun I'd go to a bakery
Officially off the Pies bandwagon
jgfisho
Posts: 59
Date Joined: 15/03/17
TB so when you or the crew
TB so when you or the crew from Gerro head offshore do you check the wind forecast in York because thats going to be your worst case scenario?
timboon
Posts: 2924
Date Joined: 14/11/10
In New York? Yeah why
In New York?
Yeah why fucking not....
Are you for real?
I'm not from Gerro, but most people i know that fish up there dont need to worry about an "Offshore" forecast because to get "Offshore" you still have to bash your way through the 25 knott southerly day in day out for 6 months of the year should you be so idiotic to want to go catch a fish once the seabreeze has kicked in...
Of course there are exceptions, if you have the luxury of owning a 50 footer then that might be your thing...
What actually is your theory behind why you think the wind often blows stronger offshore?
Dont go down that friction fucking route again either you must actually have some science behind your statement ( and no i dont want to read an article )
This topic is doing my head in, I'm going to see Frosty down at his bakery on my way to the Fremantle Dr....
jgfisho
Posts: 59
Date Joined: 15/03/17
TB - at high altitutedes the
TB - at high altitutedes the wind speed is the same, its just a large mass of air moving from one spot to another being driven by a difference in air pressure. If you go several hundred meters up in the air you won't notice a difference in wind speeds on and offshore. At the surface layer it s a different story, when that wind mass blows over land the surface wind gets trapped in trees, grass, hills, etc and it slows down. Over ocean the friction is lower and the wind doesn't get trapped so the surface wind blows unimpeded and therefor faster.
meglodon
Posts: 5981
Date Joined: 17/06/10
Weather
Look out the front door, it looks calm on the ocean, the wind is light...go fishing
Look out the front door, dark clouds ocean is full of white caps, wind is blowing very strong and howling... Don't go fishing, go back to bed.
Simple judgement for a simple fisherman.
That's my take on this weather thing.
timboon
Posts: 2924
Date Joined: 14/11/10
JGfish... Are you suggesting
JGfish...
Are you suggesting the wind blows in the same direction day in day out?
Its funny how some folk get a little stiffy about something and they cant let it go well or go of it i guess...
A bit like old Barney, not sure what ever did happen to Barney i think he might be out there still studying.....
This friction thing has got you by the nads, let it go mate because its bollocks...
If you live in Perth which i assume you do, then anytime the wind blows from ( lets assume the coast runs exactly nth/sth ) 180 deg - 360 deg then your theory is out the window as there is no land that affects it....
Say its a 20 knot westerly, are you saying that as you head out to sea the wind increases the further you go? I think not....
I dont need to check a forecast to work that out though, anyone with half an idea of how the weather patterns work will have an understanding of highs spinning anti and lows spinning clockwise and how that affects the wind direction as these high/low systems pass us by...
This is without even throwing in the arvo seabreezes that will be soon upon us daily...
You n Merman should have a bbq down at Herdsman lake, you can watch the "friction" lines all day long and roll around in the grass tickling each other saying we told him so....
I'll let you down gently though as i am not here to create enemies, I think i know what you are trying to say you just went about in the wrong way, you have to remember that most of us here are 20 mile legends like Merman and dont need some university jargon....
On a finishing note WINDS ARE OFTEN NOT STRONGER OFFSHORE........
Boon
D_d_001
Posts: 1522
Date Joined: 09/03/13
shame really
interesting topic just getting trolled to death.