Surf Casting Distance Problems

Heya

Looking for some assistance with my surf casting, I am just not getting the distance I'm hoping for when casting a ganged mulie and a Size 4 (84gm) star sinker on a 3 point swivel

I'm using a saragosa 18000f with 25lb mono and a 12 foot ugly stick gold.

I was thinking of using a lighter sinker like a size 2, but will this be to light to hold the bait out in the surf?

I have also been considering getting a different rod as I haven't been overly impressed by the ugly stick. Have been considering the daiwa surf sensor, but this is big bucks for my fishing budget.

Any suggestions?

Thx in advance....

 


Spicey's picture

Posts: 163

Date Joined: 17/01/11

Hi mate Have y0ou tried break

Mon, 2011-08-15 10:38

Hi mate Have y0ou tried break away rigs ? Check em out.

Daisy's picture

Posts: 789

Date Joined: 24/01/08

25lb Mono might be letting

Mon, 2011-08-15 10:50

25lb Mono might be letting you down a bit, do you notice much rod slap when your casting?

Can maybe look at some of the Wilson supergraphs or Shimanos new Aerowave graphite rods for less coin.

____________________________________________________________________________

The view expressed in this post is that of a self opinionated bullshitter and does not reflect that of this website, it's owners, mediators, other members or anyone else for that matter :-P

UncutTriggerInWA's picture

Posts: 2692

Date Joined: 05/09/08

Ugly Stick Gold

Mon, 2011-08-15 10:58

 I have a 12' Platinum and I have similar problems for a couple of reasons. 1. With a bad back it's getting a bit heavy for me and 2. these rods are quite whippy making it difficult to hurl a size 4. I use braid with a leader and that helps a lot.

I have very recently been convinced to change the rod setup. I purchased an 11' euPro. This rod is a lot lighter and is really quite rigid. Because it is rigid the casting capabilities are much better albeit I lose a foot in length. I am also now able to use different reels depending on conditions and what I am fishing for. I now really only carry 2 rods. My 9' Lemax for spinning/popping and the euPro for soaking baits in the surf.

Spicey is right. Breakaway rigs help heaps particularly when casting into the wind. Getting them setup right is a bit of an art.

____________________________________________________________________________

Vince.
Work smart and fish often.
Member and die-hard supporter of the mighty West Coast Eagles.

Sails4me's picture

Posts: 53

Date Joined: 27/04/09

Surf casting distance

Mon, 2011-08-15 12:25

Red

Firstly, I would advise you to check out some casting books or YouTube videos regarding techniques. The general shoulder chuck does not work very well for long casting requirements. Star sinkers and a mulie flapping about will drastically reduce the cast distance.

I would advise you to buy the best rod and reel that you can afford, and  am sure that your local tackle shop will be able to provide you with advice on what is best for you. You get what you pay, unfortunately you do get what you pay for, and the good stuff is always a bit more expensive than the budget stuff.

To get the distance required, the correct casting technique should be refined as per your individual preference. Then to use the correct terminal tackle. Generally a shcok leader of 80-100lb is a good way to start, and to use bait clips to stop your bait reducing cast distance.

Alternatively you could try the slid baiting technique which works very well. There are a number of threads on this site on slid baiting, use the search function to locate them.

Hope this helps

 

cheers

 

Sails

____________________________________________________________________________

For all your building approval advice and assistance contact Inclusive Building Consultants at inclusivebc.com

Bodie's picture

Posts: 3713

Date Joined: 05/11/07

The hardest part with any

Mon, 2011-08-15 13:51

The hardest part with any beach / surf fishing is matching your line class with your rod and reel, especially with Mono. too heavier mono on a smaller reel with heavily restrict your casting distance.

I used to only fish mono from the beach, but have since changed over to braid.

 

Again key to briad is matching your line class to your gear. Wrong line class will cause wind knots on a regular basis.

 

My setup now is a 14ft Snyderglass which ive owned for 14 years, matched with either a penn 850 with 20lb braid, or an okuma V system rinning ultra thin 30lb braid. With metal slices can easy push the distance out to around 100m i'd say, and with sinker and bait only slightly shorter.

GusG's picture

Posts: 547

Date Joined: 07/04/08

Mate, I got put onto these

Mon, 2011-08-15 14:07

Mate, I got put onto these guys and they have helped my casting out of sight - ok not that far but I am casting a lot further

www.australiansurfcastingfederation.org/AsfForum/phpBB3/index.php

Try to look up Jeremy or Chas over your way in WA - they will help you heaps

 

You might be able to find some casting vids by Jeremy or the other boys which will be very helpful.  Here are some of his vids

www.youtube.com/results

 

 

 

 

Jody's picture

Posts: 1578

Date Joined: 19/04/07

locals

Mon, 2011-08-15 14:25

Second Sunday of every month I believe.....

 http://www.surfcasters.iinet.net.au/

 

George & Terry will have you sorted in two secs ;)

 

____________________________________________________________________________

 TWiZTED

Posts: 2879

Date Joined: 27/12/06

Correct

Mon, 2011-08-15 14:31

Correct jody

Sensor surf is well worth it if you can afford it, but well worth the money IMO, those ugly sticks are a bit sloppy

cudbfishn's picture

Posts: 1309

Date Joined: 06/04/09

Its all about teqhnique. Ive

Mon, 2011-08-15 16:26

Its all about teqhnique. Ive been surf fishing since I was 8 and could outcast my dad by the time I was 14. I used to use a 10 foot overhead setup and nobody I knew could outcast me (4-6oz lead and mulie). Strength is not always the key.

If I were you Id  check out the surfcasters. You will learn heaps, Other than that there are lots of diehard beach goers on this site you might be able to tag along with. I wont be hitting the beach till summer. Im a wuss too cold.

2nd I would downgrade the line you are using. I used to always use 16lb (8kg) line off the beach if there are no rocks about. You can only push about 3kg of drag through a beach rod anyway. (if you dont believe me try it with a set of scales and your mate pulling the line throught your rod) The lighter line will give you heaps more distance. Otherwise Id use 20lb max. I now use 30lb throwing 8oz lead for slide baits which is totally different to casting a mulie.

cuthbad's picture

Posts: 1266

Date Joined: 22/04/09

I have heard that before

Mon, 2011-08-15 17:49

I have heard that before about 3kg of drag through a surf rod but I have to dissagree. With my heavy gear im pushing 8kg of drag and thumbing the spool with the rod at 45 degrees before maxing out both the rod and my own physical ability.

I agree about the ugly sticks not being up to the job. Great entry level rods but I pulled my platinum out the other day for a change it felt pretty useless. If you did decide to stick with the heavy mono I think you will need to upgrade the rod ASAP but as others have suggested braid with a shock leader is probably the way to go and should get you by for a while at least.

Clipping the bait is pretty much essential IMO. Lots of options around but I reckon the most affective (and cheapest) option is simply a small piece of wire attached to your sinker with a bend at the top which clips onto your hook or gang. Dont know how to attach a pic here but let me know if that didnt make sense and ill try to find a way to get a pic up af you want.

 

cudbfishn's picture

Posts: 1309

Date Joined: 06/04/09

Lol yer but the difference is

Mon, 2011-08-15 18:02

Lol yer but the difference is a 150 dollar rod to a 500+ dollar rod. Well we both know the difference and we know how to put more pressure on, hell the other day when I thought it was a ray at 2 am and wanted to go home, I locked the drag, pretty much held the rod straight at the water and started walking back up the beach pulling this fish (what I thought was a ray) in tug of war style. Mate was pissing himself laughing. Ended up being a shovelnose of about 40kg, still took 45 min. But ive still landed 20kg+ fish on 16lb line.

I have done the 3kg test and it is right.

cuthbad's picture

Posts: 1266

Date Joined: 22/04/09

ok i would agree with the 3kg

Mon, 2011-08-15 21:29

ok i would agree with the 3kg rule for cheaper rods, but certainly not quality surf gear.

By the way i got my rod for about 300 fom memory :-) I cant justify the price for daiwa surf gear and stuff like that

UncutTriggerInWA's picture

Posts: 2692

Date Joined: 05/09/08

A couple of comments here...

Mon, 2011-08-15 18:09

 Firstly, drag has nothing to do with casting but drag is something that can only be discussed based on the rod, reel and line. Not to mention conditions. It's a feel thing.

Secondly, the Ugly Stics are not a useless item. I have caught a lot of fish on my units and they tend  to last a long time. I find them a bit heavy these days being an old fart. Carbon for me from now on but I will still get plenty of use out of the Ugly Stics where long casting is not an issue.

The secret to the leader and braid is to load the leader in such a length that it goes a few times around the spool before the cast. That way you will not cut your finger off and have confidence to give it a really good hurl  I have tried many different strengths for leader and come back to something which resembles the strength of braid I am using.

____________________________________________________________________________

Vince.
Work smart and fish often.
Member and die-hard supporter of the mighty West Coast Eagles.

cuthbad's picture

Posts: 1266

Date Joined: 22/04/09

yea we got a bit side

Mon, 2011-08-15 21:39

yea we got a bit side tracked, just talking about drag because it relates to appropriate line strength. 

cudbfishn's picture

Posts: 1309

Date Joined: 06/04/09

Thats the idea. I used to use

Mon, 2011-08-15 18:25

Thats the idea. I used to use 8kg line based on 2.5kg of drag (back in the days were braid didnt exist) to maximise casting distance. The thinner the line the further it cast also thinner line reduced wave/wind interferance and could actually feel bites better. No point in using 15kg line for 3kg of drag if all it was gonna do was shorten your cast and drag like a bitch. And the only time I pinged off on a cast was if I tip wrapped.

These days I pendulum 6oz and slide baits down my line so the thicker the better without decreasing distance too much and have settled on 30lb mono.

For my normal stuff I use 40lb braid on an overhead. The slightly thicker braid gives better protection against overruns.

cudbfishn's picture

Posts: 1309

Date Joined: 06/04/09

btw cuthbad, im making some

Mon, 2011-08-15 18:52

btw cuthbad, im making some slides I need sum1 to try out. They will either be 6 or 7 spirals, 1.6mm ss wire, lumo bead, sinker and no welds. interested? I got some 2.4mm ss wire too but its so hard to bend. I make the rings out of it.

cuthbad's picture

Posts: 1266

Date Joined: 22/04/09

mate id live to have a go

Mon, 2011-08-15 21:34

mate id live to have a go with some home made slides, its something I have been meaning to do for ages. My personal preferance is fewer spirals but cant put any logic behind that.

I can feel summer just around the corner :-)

cudbfishn's picture

Posts: 1309

Date Joined: 06/04/09

lol Major hijack of thread.

Mon, 2011-08-15 21:48

lol Major hijack of thread. Yer cant wait for summer, heard reports theress not much along the beaches at the moment, not that im willing to try :) Got a trinidad 20a on laybuy. To match with a poseidon bantam. What rod are you running for 300? Reason for more spirals is its supposed to slide better and stop better, supposed to. I need some one to put them to the test as you are more experienced with slides. Im fairly new, I usually cast a bait.

cuthbad's picture

Posts: 1266

Date Joined: 22/04/09

pm sent

Tue, 2011-08-16 10:22

pm sent to minimise the hijack lol

Redbucket's picture

Posts: 160

Date Joined: 10/03/10

Thanks!!!

Mon, 2011-08-15 20:30

 Thanks everyone!!!

 
I have watched some videos on pendulum casting and ground casting previously but have only tried the ground casting for a couple of casts before the thunder storm seabreeze.com warned me about became a reality haha (yes I am keen, but if you got time to fish....fish.) got home to watch the video again to find I was doing it all wrong!!!
 
Trial and Error...
 
I'm definately going to move away from the ugly stick. it has done me well pulling in my first salmon and a number of  tailor, but time to retire it.
 
So the breakaway casting is a wire clip on the sinker to hold the bait in place during "airtime" where can these be readily puchased from? 
 
My mate and I will definately want try the slide baiting next time we catch some herring, and want to send out one as live bait. Again where would these be purchased from, I'd rather buy stuff initially to see how they work prior to sitting down and trying to make some.
 
I need to replace the 25lb on my saragosa reel so I'll talk to the guys at campbells, I'm going to go check out the daiwa sensors hopefully this week see what they suggest. lighter line or braid. Also get some other suggestionsas to what I can match to my saragosa. Over the phone he said the 13 foot DSS would be a good match for the 18000 size reels.
 
Will be looking to make a visit to the Surf Casting & Anglers Club soon thanks for the tip can definately use some pointers as the over the should cast just isnt cutting it for me and the pendulum looks quite dangerous to be trying standing out alone on an empty beach with only youtube for an instructor.

Posts: 501

Date Joined: 09/07/10

Mate, check out the for sale

Mon, 2011-08-15 21:07

Mate, check out the for sale section , saw a senosr surf there last week for $250 12ft, 2-4oz, i have one and i like it, not used it enough tho.

Oh and campbells priced matched for me too, got a stradic 8000 for $219, as that was what i could find it for from mo tackle on the net, thgink in Campbells they had it at $270. worth researching your prcies and asking them to match it, they can only say no.

 

Posts: 501

Date Joined: 09/07/10

heres the

Mon, 2011-08-15 21:18
sherbert's picture

Posts: 4717

Date Joined: 10/09/06

Hartland is the same

Mon, 2011-08-15 22:01

2 to 4 oz, And alot less money, But i got both of them

____________________________________________________________________________

Assassin landbase fishing club

JIM1's picture

Posts: 318

Date Joined: 08/05/11

ull want mono for sliding,

Mon, 2011-08-15 20:35

ull want mono for sliding, ive heard braid is prone to burn offs and most little tackle shops will sell the slide clips, there about $7 50 each thou:(

____________________________________________________________________________

Gravity Sucks

cudbfishn's picture

Posts: 1309

Date Joined: 06/04/09

lol yer id keep your 25lb for

Mon, 2011-08-15 21:12

lol yer id keep your 25lb for sliding. You will want the 12 or 13 ft for the gosa. The 18000 is a big reel. Bonus is with sliding all your casting is a sinker. I also definately dont pendulum with other people around. Heard some horror stories.

sherbert's picture

Posts: 4717

Date Joined: 10/09/06

Uncut trigger in wa

Mon, 2011-08-15 21:56

Pick up a great rod for under 150 .00 Ask him were Hes happy with it

____________________________________________________________________________

Assassin landbase fishing club

UncutTriggerInWA's picture

Posts: 2692

Date Joined: 05/09/08

Happy as old fart

Mon, 2011-08-15 22:12

 I'm going to introduce you to a spell checker LOL.

The only reason I got it at that price is because I am a good customer 

Sherbs is talkng about the 11' euPro I mentioned earlier. I am sure there are much more expensive versions that use the same blank 

____________________________________________________________________________

Vince.
Work smart and fish often.
Member and die-hard supporter of the mighty West Coast Eagles.

sherbert's picture

Posts: 4717

Date Joined: 10/09/06

Good to meet you john

Tue, 2011-08-16 19:51

Any time you like to call in at hocking mate, But ring first to make sure iam home

____________________________________________________________________________

Assassin landbase fishing club

Posts: 2879

Date Joined: 27/12/06

Lol

Wed, 2011-08-17 07:24

Your always home herbie, now your piece of rubbish is off the road
Pm sent redbucket

Kingfisher549's picture

Posts: 328

Date Joined: 15/09/09

Casting

Wed, 2011-08-17 10:50

Improving your distance is a two part thing. The first is the gear used and secondly your casting style.

I suggest you look at the 8144 blank rods and Pen 950 reels with 12kg mono, good balanced outfit that can handle most conditions.

I suggest you also change change hand grip, reverse your casting have your right hand at the top using greater power in your cast.

Also have the rod with a low mount reel seat.

Works for me

good luck

____________________________________________________________________________

Baron Sportsman Custom

Kingfisher549's picture

Posts: 328

Date Joined: 15/09/09

Casting

Wed, 2011-08-17 10:50

Improving your distance is a two part thing. The first is the gear used and secondly your casting style.

I suggest you look at the 8144 blank rods and Pen 950 reels with 12kg mono, good balanced outfit that can handle most conditions.

I suggest you also change change hand grip, reverse your casting have your right hand at the top using greater power in your cast.

Also have the rod with a low mount reel seat.

Works for me

good luck

____________________________________________________________________________

Baron Sportsman Custom

dkonig82's picture

Posts: 2089

Date Joined: 06/07/10

In terms of the Daiwa Surf

Wed, 2011-08-17 11:20

In terms of the Daiwa Surf Sensor rods, I notice that Campbells has them on sale at the moment.

http://www.campbellsprotackle.com/store/product.asp?ID=5481

$239 for the 12 footer, $259 for the 13.

 

____________________________________________________________________________

When asked by a non-fisherman 'how many fishing rods do you really need?' the correct answer is either:

n+1 (where n is the number of fishing rods you currently own); or

n-1 (where n is the number of fishing rods which would cause your significant other to dump you. 

sherbert's picture

Posts: 4717

Date Joined: 10/09/06

I got mine for 80.00

Wed, 2011-08-17 12:07

Still brand new, Only used twice

____________________________________________________________________________

Assassin landbase fishing club

Redbucket's picture

Posts: 160

Date Joined: 10/03/10

Couldn't help myself

Wed, 2011-08-17 18:15

Got the 13 foot Sensor Surf in the end, couldnt help myself. Sent the missus a txt to tell her I loved her to butter her up before bringing home the new toy.

Thanks for everyones help will definately be taking it out ASAP and trying out some of the different rigs and techniques suggested.

I am waiting on mail from the surf casters club to check them out and want to thank the guys from the TACKLE SHACK Malaga who gave me some AWESOME advice and were great help, will definately be telling friends to head there for gear and advice.

UncutTriggerInWA's picture

Posts: 2692

Date Joined: 05/09/08

A good result it seems Red..

Wed, 2011-08-17 18:26

 I hope you read the fine print. The welsh can be a bit dodgey you know....

____________________________________________________________________________

Vince.
Work smart and fish often.
Member and die-hard supporter of the mighty West Coast Eagles.

sherbert's picture

Posts: 4717

Date Joined: 10/09/06

Drop around sometime and show me

Wed, 2011-08-17 20:42

The new rod, If not see you in the fishing comp

____________________________________________________________________________

Assassin landbase fishing club

Posts: 180

Date Joined: 07/12/08

Hmmm....lots of

Wed, 2011-08-17 20:44

Hmmm....lots of responses....ill be nice and quick....an ugly stick wont cut the mustard.........if you want distance youll need a blank with balls in the mid to top end.........purglass, or the new light style graphite rods......saltiga surfs etc....anything with heaps of graphite in the top end and yr gonna cast far.. slow and sloppy generally sums up ugly sticks......stiff rods = quick recoil= longer casts......12ft is towards the shorter end for casting long but a heavy rated rod will help....13 to 14 ft is ideal but itll come down to personal prefrence

2nd 25lb line aint heavy for surf fishing on longer rods,,, braid with mono top shot will also aid distance

3rd....if yoou wind with yr right hand and cast low mount style rod....yr right hand needs to be at the bottom of the rod whilst yr left hand is round the reel/line area......when casting the rod goes over yr left shoulder and the but should end up down near yr right hip when yr fisnished.....with the cast going across yr body,,,

sinker size....just  bring small selection of sizes and use the lightest one that can still hold bottom........4 to 6oz in a s/wester is normal........metro id use 8/15 or 10/20 kg rod if yr gonna use mulie/star sinker  for setup

surfcasters meet at yokine reserve 1st sunday of the month from 8 onwards......terry george or one of the boys will show you the ropes

UncutTriggerInWA's picture

Posts: 2692

Date Joined: 05/09/08

Nice work 499

Wed, 2011-08-17 20:54

 Lots of technical crap there and probably most holds weight so to speak (so long as you don't own an ugly stick). We seem to have forgotten that a long cast is not aways the best. If hurling lead is what it's about then the oval is probablythe place to go. Everything in fishing comes down to  personal feel and choice and the situation at hand. Sure, we would all like to outkick Shannon Hearne or Quinten Lynch. I couldn't kick as far as they can handball now. I still catch fish though.

____________________________________________________________________________

Vince.
Work smart and fish often.
Member and die-hard supporter of the mighty West Coast Eagles.

sherbert's picture

Posts: 4717

Date Joined: 10/09/06

I got 2 purglass

Wed, 2011-08-17 21:04

A 14ft no2 and sold a no3 14ft   And a 10 ft no3 as well

Plus 12ft heartland 1to 3 oz and a  senser surf 2to4 oz

____________________________________________________________________________

Assassin landbase fishing club

Posts: 2879

Date Joined: 27/12/06

Lol

Thu, 2011-08-18 06:04

Goes to show having good rods doesn't mean you catch fish hey Sherbert lol.
Good choice on the rod redbucket

Posts: 99

Date Joined: 14/08/11

i had similar problems and

Thu, 2011-08-18 13:02

i had similar problems and since went to a wilson 9144 not to pricey and can cast 9oz so far haven't been able to fault it,

Redbucket's picture

Posts: 160

Date Joined: 10/03/10

PROBLEM SOLVED

Thu, 2011-08-18 18:26

 Just took the Sensor down the park, couldnt believe the difference, I realize that there is no mullie to add drag while in the air but I easy doubled my casting distance with no effort at all, with just an over the shoulder cast.

Looking forward to working out some of the more complex casting techniques. I'm smiling from ear to ear.

See you on the beaches :D

 

flangies's picture

Posts: 2443

Date Joined: 11/05/08

Fingers crossed on the mullas

Thu, 2011-08-18 21:29

Fingers crossed on the mullas too!

sherbert's picture

Posts: 4717

Date Joined: 10/09/06

He was so good

Thu, 2011-08-18 21:09

At casting,  But if you see the size of the park    While he was there No one was safe

____________________________________________________________________________

Assassin landbase fishing club

JIM1's picture

Posts: 318

Date Joined: 08/05/11

was he using hollowpoint

Thu, 2011-08-18 23:04

was he using hollowpoint sinkers? lolz

____________________________________________________________________________

Gravity Sucks

cudbfishn's picture

Posts: 1309

Date Joined: 06/04/09

Nice choice of rod. Good luck

Sat, 2011-08-20 08:14

Nice choice of rod. Good luck breaking it in!!!

pauldoohan1's picture

Posts: 48

Date Joined: 23/07/11

I just got a Saltiga

Sat, 2011-08-27 14:02

I just got a Saltiga Ballistic 33 13ft and attached one of those Cannon casting triggers to it, it's crazy the difference it makes to casting.  I cast 8 ounce Gemini sinker for sliding and am loving the lack of finger loss.

____________________________________________________________________________

Always at the beach.