Calling diesel mechanics
Hi guys, I have a 2000 Hilux that has served me well, but just recently it has started misbehaving a little and I have the mechanical knowledge of a retarded cat, so I'm hoping someone a little more mechanically gifted than I can offer me some explanations.
When I start it first thing in the morning, it stutters, farts and coughs so much it feels like the doors are gonna fall off and blows white smoke. Give it some juice for a few seconds and it settles down, but still vibrates intermittently with a dull like thud coming from the engine bay. Usually the white smoke disappears once the engine reaches operating temperature, although it does show up at idle from time to time, but it blows a pretty thick black smoke under throttle/load.
It doesn't appear to be using any oil, coolant or excessive fuel, but it seems like it might be misfiring or have knackered glow plugs. I'm hoping its something simple like glow plugs and not a cracked head or blown gasket. Can anyone share their thoughts on this please?
Rig
Posts: 2925
Date Joined: 27/12/06
mechanic
I am no mechanic, more of a tinkerer but getting the injectors serviced/replaced is a relatively cheap process that certainly made a difference to my patrol(was about $500 for a 6cylinder from a mobile guy that just did exchange replacement it was perth injector service I think, cut back on smoke(a bit) and gave more power run better. Injector pumps start getting $$$$ if you rebuild/replace one
It might pay to post up how many k's its done for some more accurate advice from any mechanics on here, I think tim-o is a mechanic when he isnt talking up the hawks for premiers
Justo82
Posts: 482
Date Joined: 17/10/11
hey, is it turbo diesel?
hey,
is it turbo diesel? sounds like it could be the turbo....
or... white smoke can be caused by water in your fuel... blown head gaskit..... I'd get a pro to check it out...
good luck
fisherking
Posts: 730
Date Joined: 29/05/08
+1
+1
"Some cause happiness wherever they go; others, whenever they go." - Oscar Wilde
Starbug
Posts: 563
Date Joined: 27/08/09
I'm no diesel guru, but it
I'm no diesel guru, but it does sound like dirty injectors and or faulty glow plugs. Cold starts in the morning will show up these problems.
Throw some injector cleaner into the fuel and give it a run, if the symptoms persist get the glow plugs tested.
The black smoke under load points to a injector/injector pump problem.
Justo82
Posts: 482
Date Joined: 17/10/11
also, not likely your glow
also, not likely your glow plugs. they are only used to heat the cylinders initially so they can ignite on compression.
fisherking
Posts: 730
Date Joined: 29/05/08
+1000
+1000
"Some cause happiness wherever they go; others, whenever they go." - Oscar Wilde
EKUL
Posts: 179
Date Joined: 05/01/13
Thud - Check engine mounts
Also check injectors, the thud could either be soft/cracked engine mounts or piston miss firing...just from experience.
sea-kem
Posts: 15021
Date Joined: 30/11/09
Sounds like it's carbonised
Sounds like it's carbonised up. A hard high revving run up the freeway to burn out the carbon buildup. A diesel mechanic told me about this once. Said they need a good clean out now and then and this is a good way to do it.
Love the West!
AlwaysFishin
Posts: 644
Date Joined: 13/11/11
Thanks for the comments
Thanks for the comments guys. I probably should have included some more info at the start, but to answer some of those questions/queries, yes it is a turbo (aftermarket) and its got about 220,000 on the clock, of which 40,000 has been since a reco. I have already run some injector cleaner through 2 full tanks and have seen no change. It's had some time on the freeway with and without a boat and again no change. It has had some trouble with the glow plugs before, but it just wouldn't start period, where as now it still has a bit of trouble starting but it won't run the battery dead before it starts, I just need to warm up the glow plugs like 5 times before starting. I did think about the engine mounts for the noise but haven't got under and had a look yet. I hope this information gives a bit more insight. Thanks again.
Rob H
Posts: 5807
Date Joined: 18/01/12
glow plugs glow plugs glow
glow plugs
glow plugs
glow plugs
google for how to test them with multimeter, its not hard
Note also, the indirect injection 2L and 3L heads are notorious for cracking heads between the exh valve and precombustion chambers when turbo'ed or overheated. But if theres no coolant problem then unlikely
Give a man a mask, and he'll show you his true face...
The older you get the more you realize that no one has a f++king clue what they're doing.
Everyone's just winging it.
fisherking
Posts: 730
Date Joined: 29/05/08
Honestly mate it sounds like
Honestly mate it sounds like the turbo.
It wont hurt to change the glowplugs but that will just make it easier to start in this cold weather.
If you take the glowplugs out & find a short one, then you should start worrying about pistons.
"Some cause happiness wherever they go; others, whenever they go." - Oscar Wilde
dazanator
Posts: 114
Date Joined: 20/06/13
test those glow plugs first.
test those glow plugs first. It only takes 1 Buggered glow plug to do that. Also just double check that your not losing coolant
I'm assuming that it doesnt do it when it's hot????.
THE RUSSIANS ARE COMING MY BRU!!!
Rob H
Posts: 5807
Date Joined: 18/01/12
Had 5 hilux diesels and marine engineer
dazanator is right-number one suspect is glow plugs
A dodgy glow plug will produce a rough start, white smoke and violent shudder.
Turbo-highly unlikely-symptoms of a failed turbo on start up are virtually nil.
Cracked head is also a possibility-not uncommon in 1KZ and 3L diesels-symptoms are also similar but if its not using coolant or contaminating oil then forget that for the moment.
Injectors-unlikely if it runs ok rest of the time.
Heres what Id do (and have cos Ive had all of this!)
Put a multimeter on the glow rail and turn key on-could be the relay/fuse.
If theres power there (11 volts I think), take the rail off and test glow plug resistance individually-google it
Black smoke-before anything else whether TD or non turbo, check your air filter for blockage.
EDIT-just seen its aftermarket TD-could also be fuel rack wound up too far.
To check turbo take any pipe off to allow access to spool and see if it turns freely.
White smoke-glow plugs, lack of a thermostat, cracked head
Do the easy stuff/obvious first
Have you had this a while or just bought it? ie do you know the history?
Give a man a mask, and he'll show you his true face...
The older you get the more you realize that no one has a f++king clue what they're doing.
Everyone's just winging it.
marrisy
Posts: 205
Date Joined: 08/09/11
compression ?
What you describe sounds like low compression, you can get a compression tester that screws into the glow plug seats, not hard to do with the older toyota's. I sugest you check this first, there were some cheap rebuild kits on the market that only lasted 40.000 kilometers a few years ago, ok if you only wanted to get the car going to sell it. I have seen some moters run on bio diesel mixes that had the precombustion chambers so full of white crud that it suprised me they even started. Have you been using suspect fuel? It is true that a good hard run will often clean the carbon from the cylinder heads in a diesel. let us know how you go hey.
If you over tighten the injectors after a service, you run a very real risk of cracking the head, from memory the injectors should only be tightened to about 21 or 27 ft lbs, not much more than a spark plug. Use the proper setting on a tention wrench.
A-SALT-WEAPON
Posts: 103
Date Joined: 07/07/10
fuel filter
When was the last time you had a service? Change your fuel filter might have picked up some shitty fuel.
tim-o
Posts: 4657
Date Joined: 24/05/11
Pull the glow plugs, using
Pull the glow plugs, using jumper leads connect the earth around the body of the plug and touch the posative on the end terminal, they should glow red in a number of seconds, if not replace them. If all are well id be lookin at a leaking injector. Cyl head issues or cracked bores usually result in coolant loss and comp loss doesnt fix itself. My guess the white smoke doesnt vaporise like water or coolant would so id say its unburnt fuel
I am, as I've said, merely competent. But in an age of incompetence, that makes me extraordinary.
tim-o
Posts: 4657
Date Joined: 24/05/11
And another tip for all you
And another tip for all you diesel owners, changing your glow plugs regularly will prevent too much build up on the tips. I was changing a set a few weeks back and the carbonised tip seized in the head and snapped off. The right amount of oven cleaner soak time (breaks carbon down) and a bit of crc, crank the engine over and it shot out like a bullit lol
I am, as I've said, merely competent. But in an age of incompetence, that makes me extraordinary.
tim-o
Posts: 4657
Date Joined: 24/05/11
Oh shit, I just re read your
Oh shit, I just re read your symptons, I thought it only ran rough momentarily upon start up. If it is rough all the time and more noticeable at idle then sounds like a comp issue. Intermitedly running rough (runs fine at times) and white smoke sounds like injector or injector pump issue, could have a valve sticking is the only other thing I can think of, which in the case would tick loudly and sound funny in the intake or exhaust at the time of the missfire.
I am, as I've said, merely competent. But in an age of incompetence, that makes me extraordinary.
Browndog
Posts: 590
Date Joined: 10/04/12
Smoke
White smoke = unburnt fuel
Black smoke = Partially burnt fuel
Blue smoke = oil
If it's unburnt fuel, couple of possibilities.
1) Glow plug on one cylinder not working. This would mean that cylinder is not igniting on cold starts, would produce white smoke/banging/vibration, however I would expect this would run fine after a minute or two, as glow plugs are only for initial cold starting, after that the combustion heat takes over.
2) Poor fuel atomisation due to dirty/blocked/whatever injector. Similar symptoms however wouldn't get any better with temp, may come and go intermittently. Very quick/easy/cheap to "pop test" injectors on older diesels, not sure on common rail stuff.
3) Low compression - burnt/broken valve, damaged piston, damaged/worn rings. Compression test should confirm.
Hope it helps.
jdog1980
Posts: 27
Date Joined: 20/06/10
Have you investigated a fuel
Have you investigated a fuel pump seal leak. When it sits fuel derails back and air gets in the system. Takes about 20 seconds to clear the air. Coughs and splutters but then runs fine..
barlow2
Posts: 43
Date Joined: 04/11/12
Retarded cat
is his mechanical capabilites.
pop into any reputable mechanic mate,sooner than later.
glow plug for mine,bravo presented with similar symptoms,straight to kmart tyre and auto and all replaced.310000kms before replacement.happy with that!