Finally got a new (old) boat!
Submitted by clueless on Sun, 2016-02-14 16:10
Thanks to all whos has been answering my many many questions on many different boats over the past 6months. As a newbie to boats it was such a daunting task picking a boat with minimal budget! Having little idea about any boats made choosing hard, and some times I spat my dummy out and said 'Duck it, ill never get one!'
Anywho I got one today for a really good price (I think), old savage osprey 480. :-)
Hull an trailer seem in very good condition and the old johnno 70hp ran very smooth on the water. So if anyone recognizes the boat on the river / cockburn sound give me a wave :-)
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opsrey
Posts: 1200
Date Joined: 05/10/07
Congrats.
Plenty of fun to be had in that rig. Jam the biggest sounder/gps in her and off you go. I look forward to seeing the first fish photo in her.
clueless
Posts: 58
Date Joined: 03/09/15
Sorry to let you down but
Sorry to let you down but the first fish photo isn't great ha ha but I am very happy about it as you can see!
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Ashen
Posts: 1042
Date Joined: 22/03/13
Congrats!
Congrats on your first boat, mate!
Looks really neat and those Johnno motors are reliable as long as you keep it serviced.
My friend has the exact model but with a cuddy cab, powered by a 60hp 2 stroke Yammy. Goes quite well but slaps a bit in 1m+ swells..
Enjoy and stay safe!
A fish in the hand is worth 10 in the water!
clueless
Posts: 58
Date Joined: 03/09/15
Thanks guys. Yeah hope she
Thanks guys. Yeah hope she does me well for the river and sound. Just needs some shade and ill be all set.
She did slap around on the test run, but expected for a ali boat - cant complain as i have never had a fiberglass. Sure they are heaps better but what i dont know i wony miss haha.
Does anyone know if you can retro fit a tacho gauge on the old Johnson so i can keepntracknof rpms?
out wide
Posts: 1535
Date Joined: 30/12/08
Plenty of good times coming
Plenty of good times coming up for you especially in close and the river. Don't forget to make sure all safety items are up to date. And yes be careful and stay safe.
bouttime
Posts: 703
Date Joined: 27/07/06
Nice rig for your first
Nice rig for your first boat. Dont worrie too much about rpm you will find where the sweet spot is. The 70 johno is bullet proof only prob you might have is the vro which alot of people just disconnect and run premix. Have some fun learn the ropes and upgrade when your ready.
dodgy
Posts: 4576
Date Joined: 01/02/10
Good rig. I had one of those
Good rig. I had one of those as my first boat.
Does anyone know where the love of god goes, when the waves turn the minutes to hours?
beau
Posts: 4104
Date Joined: 24/01/10
Same size ass my first tub.
Same size ass my first tub. Great to learn in and easy to handle, you'll have a ball fishing cockburn and surrounds
Rob H
Posts: 5795
Date Joined: 18/01/12
thats a perfect boat to kick
thats a perfect boat to kick off with, or to hang onto longterm.
Give a man a mask, and he'll show you his true face...
The older you get the more you realize that no one has a f++king clue what they're doing.
Everyone's just winging it.
Vinesh87
Posts: 2751
Date Joined: 02/04/11
Nice one, had the exact same
Nice one, had the exact same boat for my first boat. They are awesome, very capable!
Piggy
Posts: 548
Date Joined: 24/08/12
Awesome
Awesome little boat mate!!
I have a 5m Quintrex with the same engine, they are bullet proof engines and run even better when you disconnect the VRO. Will last you for ever!! Great boat!!
I go boating not fishing
clueless
Posts: 58
Date Joined: 03/09/15
First day out!
Finally got my RST and took the boat out on Saturday. Went great ( apart from forgetting the bungs!!) And even caught my first fish, from a bit of sausage that fell on the floor haha.
Any way I have issues with the motor, water is getting in. I replaced the washers on the drain plugs but that didnt help - still got in.
Engine starts great, idles and runs good. Am I looking for a rebuild / lower end replacement?
Or is it a case of dropping it and replacing some more gaskets.
Rob H
Posts: 5795
Date Joined: 18/01/12
what do you mean by "water is
what do you mean by "water is getting in"-to where?
Give a man a mask, and he'll show you his true face...
The older you get the more you realize that no one has a f++king clue what they're doing.
Everyone's just winging it.
clueless
Posts: 58
Date Joined: 03/09/15
Sorry... water getting into
Sorry... water getting into the gear oil. Its milky after a day on the water, it was fresh oil too.
Krusty
Posts: 714
Date Joined: 27/11/15
tell-tail
If it is water getting inside the engine cover then just check all the hoses for tightness or splits and make sure the tell-tail outlet is secure and in place. Finding water leaks can be hard sometimes but it's also good to have a good look at the engine once everything is dry and look for deposits or build up of salt !!
My fishing spots are so secret........... even the fish don't know where they are !!
clueless
Posts: 58
Date Joined: 03/09/15
Sorry for missing out the
Sorry for missing out the most vital bit of information....but i meant water in the gearbox oil as its milky.
Rob H
Posts: 5795
Date Joined: 18/01/12
.
easiest thing first, change the seals on the input shaft then if still happening get it pressure tested.
Changing the prop shaft seals are a bit more complicated.
Give a man a mask, and he'll show you his true face...
The older you get the more you realize that no one has a f++king clue what they're doing.
Everyone's just winging it.
clueless
Posts: 58
Date Joined: 03/09/15
Thanks Rob. Before i take it
Thanks Rob. Before i take it out i am looking for a workshop manual - preferably one I can download.
Rob H
Posts: 5795
Date Joined: 18/01/12
manuals
a few days back someone put up a post here with links to downloading service manuals-Ive got all mine off websites for $8US you may find them for free also.
Dropping the leg is easy usually.
Give a man a mask, and he'll show you his true face...
The older you get the more you realize that no one has a f++king clue what they're doing.
Everyone's just winging it.
Krusty
Posts: 714
Date Joined: 27/11/15
Also another seal worth
Also another seal worth checking / changing is the one on the gear selector shaft.
My fishing spots are so secret........... even the fish don't know where they are !!
clueless
Posts: 58
Date Joined: 03/09/15
Thanks rob. Bought a manual
Thanks rob. Bought a manual on cd of eBay for 7dollars. I took the leg of this eve. So next is the water pump housing.
Krusty is that the other housing....as in not the water pump? If so ill get looking for part numbers. Are they the two main seals that are worth replacing while the great box is off.
Krusty
Posts: 714
Date Joined: 27/11/15
Not 100% sure on your motor
Not 100% sure on your motor but I think there is a seperate housing just in front of the water pump housing where the gear selecting rod passes through to the gearbox.
Pretty sure the main drive shaft and the gear selector shaft are the only two seals on the top of the gearbox and are not that hard to change.
Also when changing the seals, especially on rotating shafts like the driveshaft and the prop shaft, Check to make sure that where the shaft and seal are in contact that there is not a deep groove worn into the shaft as a new seal would more than likely leak also. A small groove or mark is fine but if it's a little excessive it might need polishing out with some fine emery paper. This normally doesn't take to much to clean up.
The only other seals you have are the prop shaft ones and there are two of these in the bearing carrier. These like Rob said are a little more involved to change and I think will require a "special" tool in order to remove the carrier.
My fishing spots are so secret........... even the fish don't know where they are !!
Rob H
Posts: 5795
Date Joined: 18/01/12
Krustys right, I wrote
Krustys right, I wrote similar then it disappeared!
Bearing carrier-that's even if you can get them apart.
Sometimes its better to get a second hand gearcase
Give a man a mask, and he'll show you his true face...
The older you get the more you realize that no one has a f++king clue what they're doing.
Everyone's just winging it.
clueless
Posts: 58
Date Joined: 03/09/15
The engine is a 1981 70hp
The engine is a 1981 70hp Johnson sea horse. J70TLCIM.
OK so I got the water pump off and removed the plate that I think the parts list calls a bearing housing case #38, within that case I took out the two gaskets known as oil retainers #39. So thats cleaned and ready for the new seals. Next I removed the shift rod hosing #48. Hoever I fond no gromet (#55) or no o-ring #49 under it.... I have no idea where they could be to replace them.
clueless
Posts: 58
Date Joined: 03/09/15
Found a picture of the shift
Found a picture of the shift rod housing....I think it may be the brass ring at the top that needs to be removed.... how do you do that when it has the shaft through it!?
Krusty
Posts: 714
Date Joined: 27/11/15
So you removed the shift
So you removed the shift housing and the shift rod is still with the housing is it ?
I thought once you removed the housing it would have slid up and off the shaft !
The O ring #49 should be inside the housing probably in a recess withing the brass sleev, if it is warn and dirty in there it might be a bit hard to see it but should be there and visible once the shaft has been removed.
The gromet #55 should have been sitting on top of the housing and clearly visible with the shaft and housing still in place.
What does it say #66 and #67 is, Is that just the bolt and washer that the gearbox is bolted on with ?
My fishing spots are so secret........... even the fish don't know where they are !!
clueless
Posts: 58
Date Joined: 03/09/15
There is an S at the top of
There is an S at the top of the shift. You bhave to remove the shaft and pull it from the bottom. You are correct though, oring was in a recess on the brass section - which is corroded in place tight. I managed to get a small bemt screwdriver to remove it - getting it back will not be fun. No grommet was to be found by iv ordered one - so that sits ontop of the housing then.
Its all clean amd ready for new parts to be put on and reassembled. I hope this solves the water leak!!!
clueless
Posts: 58
Date Joined: 03/09/15
There is an S at the top of
There is an S at the top of the shift. You bhave to remove the shaft and pull it from the bottom. You are correct though, oring was in a recess on the brass section - which is corroded in place tight. I managed to get a small bemt screwdriver to remove it - getting it back will not be fun. No grommet was to be found by iv ordered one - so that sits ontop of the housing then.
Its all clean amd ready for new parts to be put on and reassembled. I hope this solves the water leak!!!
Krusty
Posts: 714
Date Joined: 27/11/15
Sounds like your getting
Sounds like your getting there mate.
The O ring shouldn't be hard to get in, just make sure the groove is nice and clean and smooth then the O ring should sit nicely in there. When it comes time to put the shaft back in just smear the O ring and shaft with some oil and slip it in.
Yea that gromet just pushes down and sits on top of that brass section....might have a recess in it to mach that step on the brass but not sure.
Hopefully all this fixes your little problem and you will be back out there enjoying the water !!
If you have not yet had a look ....remove the prop and just make sure there is nothing wrapped around the prop shaft like fishing line wrapped around where the seal is.
My fishing spots are so secret........... even the fish don't know where they are !!
clueless
Posts: 58
Date Joined: 03/09/15
Ok. Its all put together now
Ok. Its all put together now (hopefully correctly). Now, to replace the oring in the shift rod housing I had to remove the shift rod - this was done by unscrewing the rod from its place down in the bottom of the gearbox. My worry is that the shift rod screws in and out for adjustments (apparently i seen on a you tube video) so with me screwing it out and removing I have no idea what position it was in when lower unit was first removed... how can i work backwards and make sure its in the correct position?? Hope that makes sense!
Krusty
Posts: 714
Date Joined: 27/11/15
I'm not familiar with that
I'm not familiar with that set up and thought that the adjustment would be able to be made with the gearbox bolted up !!
How does the top of the rod on the gearbox secure to the (I'm guessing) rod coming down the leg ?
Normally there is a joint or adjustment somewhere which is accessible when it is all together probably behind the swivel housing somewhere or through an inspection hole.
Or failing that, I recon your best bet would be to put the gearbox in neutral and the selector in neutral and measure the distance between the two connections.!
Sorry I can't be more precise there but not seen one for many years now and the memory is strugling a bit...haha
My fishing spots are so secret........... even the fish don't know where they are !!
clueless
Posts: 58
Date Joined: 03/09/15
Ok i have put it all back
Ok i have put it all back together, and it was running sweet all weekend.... but today i checked the oil again and its cloudy again!!
I replaced drive shaft seals and shift rod seals. Is the only thing left the prop shaft seal?? I have heard that it's a bitch to get out...could the cloudy oil just be contaminated from some old oil still stook to the sides of the gearbox.
clueless
Posts: 58
Date Joined: 03/09/15
Also no water is separating
Also no water is separating in the oil after several hours of sitting there
sstevee
Posts: 472
Date Joined: 15/11/11
The best way to know for sure
The best way to know for sure is to pressure test the leg. I did mine in a cheap/DIY method.
Basically i had some all thread in the right size that screwed into one of my oil drain holes. I cut a piece of this about 40mm long and drilled a small hole lengthways through the centre of it to allow pressure into the case. I wrapped it in thread tape and screwed it into the leg. On the remainder sticking out the leg i pushed some clear hose over it and managed to get a couple of psi of pressure into it (could probably use a bike pump). I then dunked the whole leg into a large bucket of water so it was fully submerged and watched for where the bubbles were coming from.
For me it was the gasket under the water pump housing that was old and cruddy, but mines a merc so may be different.
clueless
Posts: 58
Date Joined: 03/09/15
Cheers. I guess thats my
Cheers. I guess thats my next move... i work in the gas industry so i could put together a low pressure reg and dry nitrogen. If any one lnows what pressure that would be good. Other wise ill just add a couple of psi.
Rob H
Posts: 5795
Date Joined: 18/01/12
very low, only a few psi
very low, only a few psi will be enough.
That oil is very contaminated, need to do something about that soon.
Good quality oils will often split again after sitting while but generally either heat or agitation will cause waster and oil to amalgamate
Give a man a mask, and he'll show you his true face...
The older you get the more you realize that no one has a f++king clue what they're doing.
Everyone's just winging it.
clueless
Posts: 58
Date Joined: 03/09/15
So i just had 10psi in the
So i just had 10psi in the gearbox. And used some gas leak detection 'bubbles' spray from work. No bubbles appeared from the prop seal and pressure held within the gearbox..... now what?!?
Could the milky oil be contaminated from residue left in the box that was coating the cogs and walls....
Krusty
Posts: 714
Date Joined: 27/11/15
10 psi sounds a bit high but
10 psi sounds a bit high but as long as all the seals held then all should be good.
Did you have a gauge hooked up and left it for a while so you could see if the pressure dropped at all over time....say 10mins or so ?
If it held the pressure then maybe there was a small amount of the old contaminated oil in there. It could be pooled up somewhere and like you said there could be a small amount coating the internals.
Maybe drain the oil and change it after the next couple of uses to see if it improves or remains the same.
My fishing spots are so secret........... even the fish don't know where they are !!
clueless
Posts: 58
Date Joined: 03/09/15
Yeah. I had a nitrogen
Yeah. I had a nitrogen cylinder with a regulator then a 2nd pressure gauge before going into the nylon tube thats of my omc oil pump thing.
Held 10psi, maybe up to 15mins. Slight leak but that was coming from the connection to the nylon tube. Is there any product I could use to flush the system?instead of another 30dollar tub of gearbox oil.
Krusty
Posts: 714
Date Joined: 27/11/15
Yea well that should be
Yea well that should be enough to safely say that the leak has been fixed with the replacement of the seals you have done.
I am not aware of any gearbox flushing product and can only suggest maybe buying the cheapest and thinnest gear oil you can find and use that to flush it out.
Just fill as usual and run it at home with the muffs on. Put it in gear, forward and reverse. Drain and check what it looks like and repeat until the oil comes out clean again.
I recon after a couple of cycles like that it should clear up pretty quickly.
Once it's clean and your happy then fill up with the good stuff and see how it goes next trip.
My fishing spots are so secret........... even the fish don't know where they are !!
clueless
Posts: 58
Date Joined: 03/09/15
yeah, i guess ill get some
yeah, i guess ill get some cheaper gear oil. Whitworths sells gulf outboard gear oil for $5 per liter. Cheap enough to buy 2, flush it out 3times and then get the Johnson hpf pro for the final fill.
Hopefully I just had residue oil and will have clean gearbox from now on! Wish me luck!
Krusty
Posts: 714
Date Joined: 27/11/15
At least with this method
At least with this method you can clean out the box without introducing the water factor.
Once it's flushed and clean with the muffs.....take it out on the water and check again. If it's contaminated again then the prop shaft seals are you last option.
Hopefully though it will remain clean and the problem is solved.
GOOD LUCK
My fishing spots are so secret........... even the fish don't know where they are !!
Rob H
Posts: 5795
Date Joined: 18/01/12
You do need to remember that
You do need to remember that by pressurising you are looking for something leaving the gearbox, when in fact the problem is the opposite and may not show up that way given the way oil seals work
Give a man a mask, and he'll show you his true face...
The older you get the more you realize that no one has a f++king clue what they're doing.
Everyone's just winging it.