PR vs FG vs Till - the first couple of tries and testing

So, just tried the PR knot. The first one tied is shown. It was tied with the line wrapped around my foot for tension, the braid is a length I "caught" out at the fads one day, poundage unknown.

 

I wrapped the braid around a tree out the front of my place a bunch of times, then tied a bucket to the mono and started filling it up with scuba weights ~3lb.

 

The first one, the braid snapped ahead of the knot - probably just shitty braid. It took 14x 3lb weights,  and my bathroom scale rated that at 20kg.

 

The second one pinged at 12 weights, or about 16kg. This one unravelled as it came apart somehow, you can see the ends in the image.

 

I think I might need more practise for this before its a goer, as well as probably starting to tie it in some less shitty braid. Interestingly in this Sport Fishing Knot Challenge, they tie the FG knot, but it has no ball on the mono, so how important is it?

 

Ok so I tried a few more PR knots, they broke at 50, 46 and then the braid mainline just failed repeatedly so I couldn't test it over 44lb.

 

Next, seeing as a few people went in to bat for the FG, I gave it a try and the results were pretty interesting. No knot failures, just mainline braid failures, at 42 and 51lb. I'm clearly going to have to give it a crack with some decent braid, and probably a better test station too.

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DazSamFishing's picture

Posts: 1518

Date Joined: 19/08/09

so you're not using a

Thu, 2010-09-16 12:34

so you're not using a bobbin?

if the braid is breaking before the knot, it could be because you're applying too much tension and heat when half hitching. Poor quality braid could also be the problem.

Ball in the mono is important to prevent slippage, especially if you're not using a bobbing to tie the pr knot. Just be wary of unwanted heat on the braid - for obvious reasons.

I've tested my pr knot on 50lb fins coupled to 100lb black magic. It broke at 36kg at the uni knot.

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Date Joined: 21/02/08

Na, I was using a bobbin.

Thu, 2010-09-16 14:23

Na, I was using a bobbin. The line broke so far away from the knot I think it was just a weak spot. I should test that braid for strength, perhaps it breaks at 20kg anyway?

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Posts: 499

Date Joined: 04/05/08

Pr knots if tied correctly

Thu, 2010-09-16 15:17

Pr knots if tied correctly are a 100% knot have tied them in pe8 with 80lb leader and they where breaking  at the uni on the terminal everytime..Good knot but time consuming am now tieing the mid knot its fair bit quicker and you don't need the bobbin.As for melting the mono its not needed in my opinion as the knot works like a chinese finger trap and shouldn't slip but its cheap insurance anyway.

DazSamFishing's picture

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Date Joined: 19/08/09

yeah, definitely not the

Thu, 2010-09-16 15:57

yeah, definitely not the knot you want to tie in a bit of swell & chop.

I've never had 1 break, so I've never had to tie one during a fishing trip. Just allow plenty of leader & you'll be fine.

Best knot IMO

jay_burgess's picture

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I tied one in 25 knot winds

Fri, 2010-09-17 19:27

I tied one in 25 knot winds and rain on one of the Nomad dories :)

DazSamFishing's picture

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lol that wouldn't have been

Fri, 2010-09-17 19:29

lol that wouldn't have been fun

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Date Joined: 21/02/08

I may just need a heavier

Thu, 2010-09-16 16:23

I may just need a heavier spool, it has a little lead wire on it, but its too narrow to stuff more than a few pieces of split shot up it.

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Lucky Tim's picture

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Date Joined: 28/11/07

the heavier the bobbin the

Thu, 2010-09-16 16:39

the heavier the bobbin the shorter or less wraps needed.The melted ball in nice to have, even after doing tight half hitches there is always a tiny bit of spreading ones load is placed on the mainline and leader.
Have a few more practices and we'll have a crack when I get home.
ps. and don't be a tight arse, use some of that boat braid in your cupboard and see what that PR breaks at.

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Date Joined: 21/02/08

I tied two more for testing,

Thu, 2010-09-16 20:03

I tied two more for testing, when I can get them to break a bit more reliably I'll migrate to the good stuff ... probably about the time you're back!

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DazSamFishing's picture

Posts: 1518

Date Joined: 19/08/09

the pr knot will allow you

Thu, 2010-09-16 20:43

the pr knot will allow you to screw down some serious drag pressure for sambo season.

essentially... locked drag.

Kasey L.'s picture

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Date Joined: 02/03/06

Hi Jamie, I've essentially

Fri, 2010-09-17 12:55

Hi Jamie,
I've essentially moved on to the FG knot now - it can take me less time to tie than a PR and you dont need a bobbin swinging around. It's not so easy to see on youtube or read about, but if I can show it to you, you'll see that its QED.

Worth considering - I was using the PR knot for a while but I realised after a while that the FG is still a smaller and smoother connection, and due to the cross-wraps, bites in better and more securely.

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Cool! I'll check it when you

Fri, 2010-09-17 14:30

Cool! I'll check it when you get here then!

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Posts: 298

Date Joined: 04/08/10

on the topic of knots im

Fri, 2010-09-17 18:30

on the topic of knots im always up for learning new knots and these mentioned look interesting.

down here in South aus for jigging kings we jst use bimini twist to a wind on leader and that is what im told down here to use also for samson fish when goin to perth in december

is this sucessful this method or what is difference with the knots and breakage etc

cheers

DazSamFishing's picture

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using wind-ons is fine. I

Fri, 2010-09-17 18:35

using wind-ons is fine. I know plenty of people that use them. Just make sure you buy quality wind-ons.

It's acutally a really quick & easy way to attach your leader.

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Date Joined: 04/08/10

yeh jst gonna take alot of

Fri, 2010-09-17 18:39

yeh jst gonna take alot of wind ons

is 150lb enough or go heavy runnin 90lb braid pe6

DazSamFishing's picture

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150lb is fine

Fri, 2010-09-17 19:02

150lb is fine

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how many wind ons should i

Fri, 2010-09-17 19:28

how many wind ons should i bring for 2 days fishing with shikari charters if all goes to plan weather wise

jay_burgess's picture

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Date Joined: 18/08/05

Yep the PR knot is pretty

Fri, 2010-09-17 19:30

Yep the PR knot is pretty awesome, I've tied it with PE5 up to PE12 170lb and 240lb single strand leaders. Never had one fail. Like Kasey said though it's worth learning the FG, smaller and smoother connection, doesn't need a bobbin and quicker to tie with experience.

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I just updated the title to

Sat, 2010-09-18 11:23

I just updated the title to reflect testing a few FG knots as well. Might be time to try testing a few with the good braid now.

 

Sometimes all the new knots seem pointless when you could just be fingercuff splicing mono into JB Hollow anyway ...

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grayzeee's picture

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Date Joined: 09/07/09

i'm wondering whats the best

Sun, 2010-09-19 11:47

i'm wondering whats the best you can hope for from these knots breaking strain vs time to re tie on boat??

i just tested my new frog 30lb braid .

on one end i did 50 turn bimini to an albright to 1 meter of 40lb to uni. (my old prefered method)

on the other end of the braid , i tried the 50 bimini to gt knot (cheers brody) to 1 meter of same 40lb to uni

put scales on one end and other end to car.

each time it broke just above bimini albright side , best reading 29lb.

what sort of breaking poundage would you expect from the pr or fg in same circumstances??

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If I spent half as long fishing , as I do reading this bloody forum , I'd be twice the fisherman I am. 

jay_burgess's picture

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Date Joined: 18/08/05

If tied correctly I beleive

Sun, 2010-09-19 12:48

If tied correctly I beleive you can achieve 100% knot strength with the PR and FG. Essentially they are used as a slim connection that will cast easily through guides. For this reason I think these knots are a lot more usefull when GT popping than jigging.

Although time consuming to tie, most serious GT fisherman will have spare spools with knots pre tied which will allow you to be back into the action within seconds. In most situations the amount of bust offs you would have in a day would be few so having a couple of spare spools would mean rarely having to re tie on the boat.

While your knots achieved good knot strength, subsequent casting would destroy an albright and both these knots would not cast well through guides.

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Date Joined: 21/02/08

I bother to retie GT to

Sun, 2010-09-19 13:12

I bother to retie GT to bimini on the very few occasions that I lose one, I have seen people tie a slacker knot and it fails, or it sticks in the guides or whatever.

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DazSamFishing's picture

Posts: 1518

Date Joined: 19/08/09

the pr knot was

Sun, 2010-09-19 15:18

the pr knot was traditionally a jigging knot, although, it's also a superb knot used when popping (ease of casting through guides). It also acts in a similar way as a wind-on leader (also due to ease of winding onto your spool).

If I have an unfortunate case of line burn or breakage & a new knot is needed to be tied (and I don't have a spare spool on me), a GT knot is quick & strong.

Grayzee, if your line is breaking above your bimini, you may find when tying a bimini, you're causing too much heat/friction which obviously will damage your braid.

 

grayzeee's picture

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Date Joined: 09/07/09

cheers jay.    

Sun, 2010-09-19 14:19

cheers jay.

 

 

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If I spent half as long fishing , as I do reading this bloody forum , I'd be twice the fisherman I am. 

grayzeee's picture

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Date Joined: 09/07/09

could well be Daz. i never

Sun, 2010-09-19 15:43

could well be Daz. i never wet the braid when doing a bimini Undecided

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If I spent half as long fishing , as I do reading this bloody forum , I'd be twice the fisherman I am.