AFL 2023
Submitted by Jackfrost80 on Tue, 2023-03-07 14:13
Anyone want to have a crack at the end of season AFL ladder? Last week I had West Coast in the top 8 
1. Geelong
2. Brisbane
3. Sydney
4. Melbourne
5. Fremantle
6. Collingwood
7. Richmond
8. Carlton
9. Western Bulldogs
10. Gold Coast
11. Port Adelaide
12. Adelaide
13. GWS
14. Essendon
15. St Kilda
16. West Coast
17. North Melbourne
18. Hawthorn
____________________________________________________________________________
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davewillo
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Yeah it would have to have
Yeah it would have to have been when JK was still running around Brock. Made him look half decent some weeks! Usually when the result was already decided mind you!
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still trying
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In the past the Eagles have
In the past the Eagles have been good at rebuilding quickly but if the club can't/ doesn't admit that its last 2 years have been brought about by poor management not poor luck with injury than they will be out of this competition for a long time. You can taint your culture very quickly.
rather be fishing
Jackfrost80
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Date Joined: 07/05/12
Hewitt - ankle, Chesser -
Hewitt - ankle, Chesser - knee, Cole - ankle, Cripps - ankle, Sheed - fractured throat, Edwards - wrist, Culley - ACL. Yes, we have a lot of senior players and younger players with soft tissue injuries which is highly concerning but to say that all of our wowes are due to poor management and not poor luck is somewhat inaccurate. You don't build a winning culture by throwing the baby out with the bathwater and playing a bunch of youngsters week in, week out although I am on the record for a few years now saying that we needed to trade both Gaff and Darling whilst they still had some currency but it’s too late now and both players are are an actual liability onfield, on good coin and unable to be moved on for anything.
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davewillo
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Date Joined: 08/09/16
I think it's a combination
I think it's a combination of bad luck and bad management Frosty. There has to be some issues with conditioning and list management, then throw is a big dose of bad luck. Hard to see daylight for a while yet.
Was at the Freo game and I'm definitely not convinced yet. They played better but not enough for the faithful to get too excited just yet.
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still trying
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If you guys don't do
If you guys don't do anything different to what you did last year next year you will get the same results your getting this year. Yes you guys played in the 2018 grand final so did Collingwood look at the 2 teams positions now. Collingwood made some massive errors and had too pay for them but in the end have come out way in front.
rather be fishing
sea-kem
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Date Joined: 30/11/09
That's what happens when you
That's what happens when you save on dental work, plenty of money under the cap lol
Love the West!
Jackfrost80
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Date Joined: 07/05/12
I agree that we could have
I agree that we could have been more ruthless especially with extending NicNat another two years which still has me flabbergasted. Last year we brought in 4 players within the top 30 including a highly rated ruckman and pinched a beauty in Noah Long at pick 58 as well as Culley in the mid season draft. I’d dare say in the likely event that we finish last that we are a real possibility of seeing if we can get two top 10 picks and another first rounder for pick 1.
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tcarroll
Posts: 265
Date Joined: 17/12/13
Coach/Culture
Not sure when Chris Fagan took over as coach at Brisbane but I'd suggest a new coach/culture played a significant part in that rebound. Same as you eluded to at Collingwood. New coach/culture and spirit/confidence in the group can prosper. I truly think this is the first step required for West Coast. The first step to improving your list is improving your culture.
I still think "rebuilds" are necessary in some instances to right your wrongs if you managed your list poorly, however I am increasingly of the belief that good list management and culture can be sustained indefinitley without the need to for any rebuilds. Geelong are a classic example of this. 4 flags, 2 GFs, 7 prelims, 4 other finals and only missed the finals twice in the last 20 years..... for the last 6 or so years every year I was suggesting their list was too old and they were destined for a rebuild. Every year they have proved me wrong and with their mature list and have managed to develop younger players for succession when the older blokes eventually move on.
Obviously all of the cogs need to be working together to maintain this level of sustained success but it certainly has me thinking that this is the ultimate blueprint to avoid any true "rebuild" period.
uncle
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Date Joined: 10/02/07
Geelong have a history
of drafting in star footballer. Danger Cameron
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tcarroll
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Date Joined: 17/12/13
Two to tango
Because stars want to play there..... Good culture + good list management.
Jackfrost80
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Date Joined: 07/05/12
We've never had a history of
We've never had a history of chasing marquee players moreso have a history of building a side and then bringing in players to strengthen our depth e.g. Stenglein and Chick before 2006 and Yeo and Redden in 2018.
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big john
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Date Joined: 20/07/06
Deja Vu
One part of me thinks the Eagles woes deserve their own thread, ala Pretty Dire at Pieland.
Maybe 'Cooked at the Coasters' or ......
But then again that Pies thread of Frosty's was the start of the turn around at the Pies, so maybe don't bother with an Eagles one.
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Jackfrost80
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Date Joined: 07/05/12
Bit behind the times there
Bit behind the times there BJ. 'Cooked at the Coasters' was 1999 to 2007
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big john
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Haha
That's true.
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Billcollector
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Good to see you back
Good to see you back commenting on the football bj collingwood must be going alright....
big john
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Date Joined: 20/07/06
Observations
Observations only BC. There is lot of commenting that could be happening, you only need to read some of the drivel in the Pretty Dire at Pieland thread. According to someone on there, drafting Nick Daicos was a risk as he had only played against 17 yr olds.
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Billcollector
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Date Joined: 16/05/09
Welcome back
Jackfrost80
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Date Joined: 07/05/12
There was a significant
There was a significant amount of drivel but most of it was not around picking Daicos moreso the fact that Pies could have ended up with pick 2 AND Daicos. Might have set you up even more nicely for your third flag in 66 years to go with the 2023 May Premiership
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big john
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Drivel
Other bit of drivel was someone trying to saddle Daicos with the FIGJAM2 moniker.
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Jackfrost80
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Date Joined: 07/05/12
Hardly drivel considering
Hardly drivel considering they're both uncontested receiver specialists. Kind of like fast Andrew Gaff's that can actually hit a target.
Ima pay myself that one.
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big john
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Date Joined: 20/07/06
The Oracle
According to Daniel Hoyne from Champion Data, he is the current number 4 rated player in the comp (after 32 games mind you).
Glad he's on the Pies list and glad they're starting to tag him. All part of his development.
WA based manufacturer and supplier of premium leadhead jigs, fligs, bucktail jigs, 'bulletproof' soft plastic jig heads and XOS bullet jig heads.
Jigs available online in my web store!
Jackfrost80
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Date Joined: 07/05/12
You said seagull not me lol.
You said seagull not me lol. If we're looking at stats then here are some more compared to the league:
Uncontested possessions: 1st
Contested possessions: 98th
Clearances: 115th
Tackles: 268th
Is an elite ball user, runner and play reader and is no doubt set for greatness and possibly a Brownlow in only his second year but in a hard fought grand final I'd ball winners like The Bont, Dusty and Oliver everytime.... oh and Shuey of course.
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big john
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Date Joined: 20/07/06
Develop
and you don't think he'll develop into that? He's played 32 games.
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big john
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Date Joined: 20/07/06
and he's comfortably in the
and he's comfortably in the top 15% for contested possessions.
and top 20% for clearances.
Not bad for the second year blues.
Gary Ablett Jnr didn't click until his 6th season.
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uncle
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Sure you'd have him
At the girls frosty
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Jackfrost80
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In a heartbeat. In fact we'll
In a heartbeat, every team still needs their outside ball users and we possibly have the worst in the league. In fact we'll give you Gaff, NicNat AND Darling for him lol
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tcarroll
Posts: 265
Date Joined: 17/12/13
Get a move on
18 months is a long time to wait in the current system..... With the impending Tasmanian team likely to have access to most of the top end talent for many years, i'd be getting on the front foot ASAP.
I think the risk is if you aren't proactive about change then any talent that you do have may well start to look elsewhere in the next 6-18 months. I despise Eagles so more than happy for them to take as long as they want but not sure i'd feel that way if I was a supporter!
Jackfrost80
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Date Joined: 07/05/12
I don’t really buy into the
I don’t really buy into the whole Tasmania thing affecting West Coast’s list rebuild.
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davewillo
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Date Joined: 08/09/16
Pretty good assessment of it
Pretty good assessment of it Frosty. I don't know/retain anywhere near the deatil you have but it all makes sense.
There seems to be a little confusion about Simmo's contract. Some say it's until 2025 so there must be some sort of extension clause in it. I agree that they will probably stick with him until the end. Firstly there are no really good, proven coaches kicking around at the moment, and secondly, exceeding the soft cap makes sacking a coach a very expensive exercise. WC have the cash but unlikely the desire to move him on. I think the problems go much deeper that the senior coach. Does anyone know what Geppy does?
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tcarroll
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Date Joined: 17/12/13
Absolutely!
Yep, sure to be an expensive exercise and agree the problems are likely much deeper than the senior coach. If there is no desire, it could be a long road to recovery!
I certainly won't profress to be across the calibre of the assistant coaches across the league but have been caught more by the immediate impact of some of the assistant/development coaches getting senior gigs in the last 10 years.
West Coast are a very proud club so I'm sure they'll work it out, but hopefully not :)
Jackfrost80
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Date Joined: 07/05/12
That last line had me loudly
That last line had me loudly pissing myself laughing in the office haha.
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uncle
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Date Joined: 10/02/07
Karma day
Ist time swans have played us at G for 10 years
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Billcollector
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Can you remember the last
Can you remember the last time you didn't play at the G ....
uncle
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Date Joined: 10/02/07
Yeah the last 2 weeks in Adelaide
Comes to mind ha ha, someone's gotta keep the comp going billy
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uncle
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Date Joined: 10/02/07
Yeah the last 2 weeks in Adelaide
Comes to mind ha ha, someone's gotta keep the comp going billy
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Brock O
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Freo to beat the swans this
Freo to beat the swans this week..get on it.
Jackfrost80
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Date Joined: 07/05/12
Good pickup Brock. They
Good pickup Brock. They looked relentless pressure-wise from the bits I saw
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uncle
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Date Joined: 10/02/07
Don't boo please
They'll be hurting brocko, this will tell where your at
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Brock O
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Yes true, but would like to
Yes true, but would like to think is more than doable after there last few games.
We then have Geelong & Melbourne...thats a test there.
uncle
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Date Joined: 10/02/07
Another good weekend in footy
Big coxy has landed, what a game
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Jackfrost80
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Date Joined: 07/05/12
Darcy Cameron back this week
Darcy Cameron back this week or next as well hey Unc?
Looks like the Hawks are taking the Harley Reid Cup seriously and have taken tanking to new levels and pulled the Covid card.
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Brock O
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Date Joined: 11/01/08
Its really the block buster
Its really the block buster of the round...17th v 18th. only .5% separating them.
Wet Toast might pull a Roos Lyon and leave a few of there stars at home...BaaaHaaa.
Jackfrost80
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Date Joined: 07/05/12
What stars? lol
What stars? lol
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big john
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Date Joined: 20/07/06
Mockbuster
Deadset Mockbuster.
WA based manufacturer and supplier of premium leadhead jigs, fligs, bucktail jigs, 'bulletproof' soft plastic jig heads and XOS bullet jig heads.
Jigs available online in my web store!
Jackfrost80
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Date Joined: 07/05/12
10 contested possessions for
10 contested possessions for Daicos on the weekend. Ima just stop commenting on Collingwood
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uncle
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There's no need to rush
anyone back, have some real back up now
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Brock O
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Yep...Wouldn't be surprised
Yep...Wouldn't be surprised if Freo bring an upset this week
uncle
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Date Joined: 10/02/07
Yeah didn't pick
The tiggers
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carnarvonite
Posts: 8667
Date Joined: 24/07/07
Like wise
Didn't pick the tiges but picked Dockers to beat the swans so still finished up with 8 and a season total of 60
Brock O
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Not bad...Our leader sitting
Not bad...Our leader sitting on 61. I've just climbed of the bottom..
Jackfrost80
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Date Joined: 07/05/12
I'm actually doing ok this
I'm actually doing ok this year sitting 2nd but still a couple short
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davewillo
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I couldn't get into the FW
I couldn't get into the FW tipping but I'm now third in the big family comp I'm in. I have gone from 14th out of 18 to outright third but we have a bolter on 62 who will be hard to catch. Still way better than I've done in recent years.
PGFC member and lure tragic
uncle
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Date Joined: 10/02/07
Interesting read on today's rag
The road travelled since 2018 for pies and e girls
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davewillo
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Pretty fair assessment IMO
Pretty fair assessment IMO Unc. It was what I was referring to in an earlier post.
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Gadsy
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Date Joined: 01/05/10
Interesting
I didn't think I had joined this comp, but there I am in 13th spot lol. Doing better here than the other comp I'm actually in, as I'm dead last there ha ha!
uncle
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Date Joined: 10/02/07
Haven't been picking pies
Just e girls ha ha
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uncle
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Date Joined: 10/02/07
Another great weekend of footy
Norff and the e girls next. Bring it on
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uncle
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Date Joined: 10/02/07
Another great weekend in footy
Thanks for the 5 teams in the 8 for losing, 300 for sidebottomand 100 for big coxys, egirls next, bring it on
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carnarvonite
Posts: 8667
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Tipping nightmare
Was a tipsters nightmare, got to think myself very lucky to fluke 5 from 9, gives me a season total of 73
davewillo
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You did well - I only got 3
You did well - I only got 3 right!
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Brock O
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Well Done Freo, Well...these
Well Done Freo, Well...these young forwards at 19 years old, let along Jackson smashing the 3rd quarter with no Darcy and running out the game. Fkn machine!!
Slowly building..looking forward to the rest of the season.
davewillo
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Hate to admit it but it was
Hate to admit it but it was a good win for Freo. Not buying the Flogmantle stuff yet though.
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uncle
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Date Joined: 10/02/07
What's Mr Picket been up to
Hard to believe hey
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Jackfrost80
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The mind boggles. Cops must
The mind boggles. Cops must have been waiting for his after the game.
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uncle
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Dockers will feel
Ripped off
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sea-kem
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LOL he's a safe pickett
LOL he's a safe pickett
Love the West!
uncle
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Date Joined: 10/02/07
Never really in that one
Still top of the tree but
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carnarvonite
Posts: 8667
Date Joined: 24/07/07
Buffer
Yes, still on top of the pile but that 4 point buffer has gone so the finger has to stay pulled out and keep the head up.
Tipping had a hit, only got 4 to bring me to 81, 5 off the leader
Jackfrost80
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Were supporters booing Grundy
Were supporters booing Grundy or the List Manager?
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uncle
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Players still respect him
Young diacos going at 94% efficiency
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Jackfrost80
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Freakish skills and
Freakish skills and definitely inherited the old man's right boot just needs to slot a few bananas now.
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uncle
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Hoping peddles can
Get to 400 games
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Jackfrost80
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Should be 282-284 by the end
Should be 282-284 by the end of the season so will be up to his body next season. He never seems to get injured but might do a Mark LeCras if they win the flag.
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Jackfrost80
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Buller debut for Swan
Buller debut for Swan tomorrow night. See if West Coast made an error in not putting Nicnat on the LTI list or not
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uncle
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Where was he from
Frosty?
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Jackfrost80
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Claremont. Eagles were into
Claremont. Eagles were into him for the MSD but went cold on him after his WAFL form dropped off and he didn't do much in the WA v SA game.
Officially off the Pies bandwagon
Jackfrost80
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2 touches for 0.0 in a half
2 touches for 0.0 in a half before being subbed out
Officially off the Pies bandwagon
Jackfrost80
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All aboard the Flagmantle
All aboard the Flagmantle Express. Choo choo
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davewillo
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Was thinking the same thing
Was thinking the same thing Frosty!
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uncle
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Where did all those media stars go
The fwds
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sea-kem
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Must be time for a rebuild
Must be time for a rebuild lol
staying in Richmond was funny to hear the crowd and the sirens at the G last night
Love the West!
Brock O
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Why would they not bring in a
Why would they not bring in a ruck to replace a ruck...crazy last two weeks fell apart again..
Any hack would have done...leave Jackson forward.
Billcollector
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BYE BYE Simpson that is just
BYE BYE Simpson that is just now utter crap......
uncle
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They would have to wouldn't they
Who takes over? Who recruited sps?
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Billcollector
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Got no idea on both those.
Got no idea on both those. Jack Darling needs to f@%k off with the looking for free kicks as well, it is getting boring. Harden up and start playing the game.SPS seems to run around a lot but does fuck all in reality and has been doing it most games, if they had a better fit list you woulndn't bother with him.
Jackfrost80
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Phwoar!!! I usually try to
Phwoar!!! I usually try to take a glass half full approach but that was brutal. Sydney just waltzing out of the bouncedowns and kicking goals at will against Shuey, Yeo and Sheed. Pretty sure I heard Simmo day we only had two listed players in their WAFL side massacre too
My son's decided he'd join his uncle last year barracking for the Saints and we've got tickets in the nosebleed section next week. Somehow methinks a free seat upgrade is on the cards.
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timboon
Posts: 2957
Date Joined: 14/11/10
Jeepers.... 4th biggest loss
Jeepers....
4th biggest loss in VFL/AFL history, that is a big deal right there...
I think they will claim 1st 2nd and 3rd also next year...
I'd be giving Simpson a new contract, who else will take over and whats the point??
If you were a new coach and you are going to lose every game in 2024 and most likely by an average of 60 + points, where is the fun in that!!
Keep Simmo on, get some DECENT youngsters in and try and win a few games....
If you are a betting man, you are making around 10-25% every week on the eagles losing + 25 points..... Get on board, I can't beleive sportsbet is still paying it out!!
On another note ) i'm sure its been spoken about elsewhere here, how fucking good was the ashes!! I couldn't goto bed and so glad I watched every run that night, Pat Cummins might have gained a few fans, awsome effort!!
sea-kem
Posts: 14967
Date Joined: 30/11/09
Eagles are in more shit than
Eagles are in more shit than the first settlers. The disgrace on the field we are being spoon fed is making me gag. But I will be loyal and wait for the eventual glimmer, imo the executive should all be sacked for letting it get to this.
Love the West!
timboon
Posts: 2957
Date Joined: 14/11/10
Yep agree Andy, Don't think
Yep agree Andy,
Don't think you can blame the players or the coaches.
I think it runs deeper than that...
uncle
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Date Joined: 10/02/07
Phew, dodged a bullet again,
Was at the grandsons soccer, will watch later, probably won't watch the 3rd quarter though
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