Ford v's Holden.
Submitted by D_d_001 on Sat, 2015-11-07 13:12
in the market for a new Ute.
been looking at ranger v's Colorado.
For same price I would go the ranger however Colorado's LS-x auto goes for bit under $40 v's Ranger XLS (similar features) bit under $50k
sure they both tow well which is big priority for me. (looked at the Dmax which I really liked but not sure I can justify buying a new car that has less power/torque than I have now.
so the question is are the Rangers worth 25% more ? I've always had decent cars but never bought new b4 for some reason or other.
anyone been in same situation recently or driven especially towed with both?
holth
Posts: 812
Date Joined: 09/10/06
My mate picked up a demo
My mate picked up a demo ranger xlt for 44k with only 4000ks on it awhile back.
Good head room even for my mate whos 6'7. His head touches the roof in the collie for comparison .
I was impressed with the gas milage on a recent run upto kalbarri fully loaded. Running low 9s which is the same hes getting around town.
Ive got a 2010 pk and theres alot more room overall as there a bigger truck, but the seats in the back are still alittle uncomfortable for my liking.
There a 60k vehicle once you start putting canopies bullbars spotties and good tyres on.
timmy k (not verified)
Posts: 16
Date Joined: 01/01/70
Go the ranger
Go the ranger
Anyfishwilldo (not verified)
Posts: 16
Date Joined: 01/01/70
Ive got the new colorado ltz
Ive got the new colorado ltz and i would go the ford... put simply mines using oil as is my mates! Common problem with the colorado affer you start asking around... the dmax may have less power but has the d10 rating meaning can do 500k with no major servicing...
D_d_001
Posts: 1522
Date Joined: 09/03/13
Really makes me think twice
Cheers ....Really makes me think twice about Colorado when a new owner says go Ranger
Swompa
Posts: 3909
Date Joined: 14/10/12
Ranger all the way
Ranger all the way
JamesB
Posts: 49
Date Joined: 12/11/12
Collie
My heart wanted a Ranger, but my wallet could only afford a Colorado.
Got a MY14 LTZ Manual. So far pretty happy with it. Towed the camper van to Kalbarri and back last holidays on 10 to 11 l/100km. Does Albright on the beach. Went to wilbinga with a ranger and a land cruiser a few months back, all vehicles successfully tackled the same obstacles and soft sand (with highway tyres). So far I'm pretty happy with it. It does use oil, but some say can be overcome if you use a higher viscosity. It does suffer turbo lag at times which can be a bit annoying.
D_d_001
Posts: 1522
Date Joined: 09/03/13
hey just curious how much oil
hey just curious how much oil it uses and if it's more to do with EGR than motor any idea?
JamesB
Posts: 49
Date Joined: 12/11/12
Oil
I put 5l in at about 7000km, and have only just cracked 10000km, but haven't checked it since. Don't know where it goes as it's not blowing smoke or anything. If you look around on the forums there are a lot of people moaning about it, but if you're doing regular prestart checks yourself before any big trip then it should be under control.
Mine is still standard, but I'm thinking about a 2" lift before I put a bull bar on it. There are a lot af negative comments about the clearance, but I've had mine at Wilbinga, and Preston beach, both pretty soft sand, and didn't have any troubles. It tows like a train. I've got a jayco swan camper van, 1200 to 1500kg loaded and it pulls that like a toy. The collie needs to be revved a bit more in low gear, but cruises at 110km/he on 1500 revs. I stalled it a lot around town until I got used to it. I've got as low as 7.5l/100km around town (over 500km)'but usually 7.7 to 8.
i haven't driven a ranger under similar conditions so can't make a meaningful comparison. I drive lancruisers and hilux at work, and it beats the stuffing out of a hilux, and a much better ride than a land cruiser.
sea-kem
Posts: 15039
Date Joined: 30/11/09
I have a new ranger Wildtrak
I have a new ranger Wildtrak and the best mid size 4WD I've ever owned. Plenty of power, features and very comfortable. I read a few forums as I was considering a Colorado and read that the dash etc lets a lot to be desired in quality. But the running gear is ok. Never go a Triton, i rue the day I ever bought that last piece of shit. The mechanical problems I had with it were ridiculous, the guy who has the business next door to me has one and is having similar dramas.
Love the West!
D_d_001
Posts: 1522
Date Joined: 09/03/13
love the wildtrack sat in one
love the wildtrack sat in one at the Ford dealer yesterday .....had to get out quickly before I did something irrational !!!
D_d_001
Posts: 1522
Date Joined: 09/03/13
Cheers for all the comments
Cheers for all the comments guys. Test drove a Colorado and was pretty good but any new car is going to be pretty decent..
Was more worried about longevity ....guess that's why I liked the dmax but again 380NM ??? torque curves smoother to most so may be OK though.
Consensus seems to be Ranger but still a hard decision considering the very sizable price difference.
In no hurry as my current car is really fine.
just need a ford end of year sale I guess !
Rig
Posts: 2925
Date Joined: 27/12/06
torque curve
its all about the torque curve if your interested in towing, don't be baffled by all the specs they throw at you. X amount of kW at 5000rpm means nothing as how much driving are you dong at 5000rpm and its actually not relative because of gear ratios etc
FWIW I have had a Dmax for about 18 months now, have been very impressed towing my boat (1.2T) plus fully loaded car it is just as good as my friends 100 series V8 petrol naturally aspirated stock standard cruiser but will use easily half as much fuel doing the same trips, I know this because we have alternated cars on the same repeat trip. That's the sort of real info you wont find out from a dealer.
having driven all the utes before buying mine there isn't a huge difference I found but I got a LST Dmax for just over 40K, the top spec Colarado could be done for a similar price at the time too. But only once I told Holden what price Isuzu could do but I preferred the reliability of the motor in the DMax anyway
D_d_001
Posts: 1522
Date Joined: 09/03/13
some good info there
some good info there ...cheers rig. nothing like getting "real" info.
unfortunately the min I tow is usually around the 2T mark boat around that fully loaded and horse float more 1.2 MT - then 2 x 500kg horses in the back. Plus all the sh@t that the missus piles up water horse feed ...portable steel float yards for the horses and the weight is really getting up there.
Curious if you've towed 2.5T with it ? your's auto or Man?
Rig
Posts: 2925
Date Joined: 27/12/06
tow
No I haven't towed anything heavier than my boat. I have seen people towing some big glass rigs that would be up around 3T easily but unsure on the results. I think you may need to consider a suspension upgrade in your list of aftermarket items for those weights on any of the utes in this category that you are looking at. There are a few horror stories getting around of people using air bag suspension as a supplement and having a few issues with cracked chassis, not sure which make/models though so do your research if you are gonna go down that path
one thing I would thoroughly recommend though is the auto gearbox, I will never own a manual again
FWIW the dealer (sceptical) told me the DMax uses the same auto gear box the land cruiser, if that's true it could only be a good thing
D_d_001
Posts: 1522
Date Joined: 09/03/13
cheers Rig.I have an auto
cheers Rig.
I have an auto ATM and only really only considering auto in the upgrade. backing boat and pulling out of water auto is the go.
have done some research into the cracked chassis and seems to be the Colorado with added bags ...Ranger seems solid.
mind you 2.5 would be the very most towed and that's usually shorter trips. the boat on north trips is 2T.
once again cheers
crowie
Posts: 91
Date Joined: 16/11/14
I got the LST DMAX
I have towed my boat to a few places now, longest distances being rockingham to Esperance and rockingham to Denham. On the way to esperance it was 42 degrees, i had the aircon blasting and car was loaded. I towed my Bayshore 6.8 down there which weighs 2.5 to 2.7 loaded (which it was) and the DMAX ate it up. Great Car IMO
dano83
Posts: 790
Date Joined: 25/05/12
Most 4x4s crack/bend chassis
Most 4x4s crack/bend chassis if airbags are used incorrectly somwouldnt let that worry you to much
BarraSlayer
Posts: 287
Date Joined: 14/04/14
BT-50 cheaper... essentially
BT-50 cheaper... essentially the same car?
Cheers
BarraSlayer
sea-kem
Posts: 15039
Date Joined: 30/11/09
Yeah same donk and not a bad
Yeah same donk and not a bad unit from what I'm told.
Love the West!
D_d_001
Posts: 1522
Date Joined: 09/03/13
yep the BT-50 certainly was
yep the BT-50 certainly was looking like a good option however (after just an internet search and without contacting dealers)
the Bt-50 seems to be pretty well same price as Ranger ATM
wez0062
Posts: 334
Date Joined: 02/09/14
Ford Everest
I went out 2 weeks ago to buy a Ranger. Coming out of a Kluger AWD , I was not that impressed with a the ride of the Ranger( probably all utes are pretty much the same) as the Kluger is very smooth. Then, out of fun, took the new Ford Everest ( base model) for a ride.
well, the decision was too easy, I brought the Everest. Had it on the road for just over a week now and very impressed with ride, comfort and creature comforts inside the car. I am pretty sure it will preform just as good as the ranger, and with 470nm of torque, I am sure we wont get stuck in a hurry. The base model Everest was still cheaper than the XLS Ranger ( lastest model ) so all in all, I am very happy with my choice
Wez0062
D_d_001
Posts: 1522
Date Joined: 09/03/13
nice car but I just cant get
nice car but I just cant get by without a ute. Need for work and.....missus and daughter and their horses .....bales of hay and horse sweaty saddles blah blah....in the back of the car just don't go well..... there's just no stopping them ....lol
scottnofish
Posts: 1621
Date Joined: 28/08/07
i have had my rg Colorado
For 3 years now done 60000 ks trouble free done probaly 15 thousand towing 3.5 ton cat had a Ranger before that and couldn't tow the boat with that fuel consumtion heaps better on the holden but the fords have a different engine now so dont know what there like now .cant say ive noticed any turbo lag in mine but the ranger i had was shocking
D_d_001
Posts: 1522
Date Joined: 09/03/13
cheers scott so no oil
cheers scott
so no oil usage? I assume you had the 3.0l ranger ? which is a whole different car from the current.
you have auto or man ? no aftermarket upgrades?
bradz
Posts: 693
Date Joined: 29/10/07
Torque curve and gearing
Yep, stats are confusing. If you look at many of the small commercial diesel trucks (Fuso, Canter) around the place, like tippers, they have high GCMs (11,700kg) and GVMs (8,550kg) but only have about 400NM of torque. Its all about the rev range. And they only have 130kw or so.
Not quite the same driving a truck compared to a dual cab ute...but you get my point, hopefully.
I did then the best that I knew how. When I knew better, I did better.
scottnofish
Posts: 1621
Date Joined: 28/08/07
first 10,000 ks used a bit of oil
had to put a few litres in before the service ,but since then only about a litre between services up til about 40,000 now dosnt use stuff all, we run a fleet of 7 colorados at work and about 30 Australia wide and only 1 has had any major problems (blew the crank after 500 ks) but that was it ,no mods on mine,sits nice and level with 300 kilo on tow ball ,towing my cat which is a hard top with full windscreen weighing over 3 ton I am getting around 20l/100ks and towing a mates cat with no windscreen that weighs 2 ton im getting around 16l/100ks normal around town I get 9.5l/100k .Mines the auto ,in the Colorado range the manual was only rated to 3 ton but the auto is 3.5 ton
D_d_001
Posts: 1522
Date Joined: 09/03/13
great info there ..especially
great info there ..especially about the fleet and the oil usage (run in?) when new (wonder if JamesB and anyfishwilldo have read this)
cheers again
Jackfrost80
Posts: 8156
Date Joined: 07/05/12
I requested a change for my
I requested a change for my work vehicle from Hilux to Ranger as Toyota were lagging in the safety feature department and have never looked back. Got the 2.2 turbo deisel and it tows my 1500kg boat effortlessly
Officially off the Pies bandwagon
crowie
Posts: 91
Date Joined: 16/11/14
another dmax owner
Great cars i think, isuzu reliability and serviceability is what i went for. Easy to work on and service yourself and pulls my 7m boat (2.5t) easily and i get around 15 l per 100km towing it. Upgraded to the 2 inch lifted +300kg springs in the rear which suck bigtime when no weight in the back but sits perfect when towing and loaded. No issues since new and would buy another one in a heartbeat. Not as quick or as powerful as some of the others, but i didnt buy it to go fast :)
Mooseknuckle
Posts: 112
Date Joined: 14/05/13
DMax owner POV
Had a DMax now for almost 2 years and impressed with everything except economy whilst towing. Have a tall 6.5m alu c/console and getting crap economy at 100km/h = 19 to 20L/100k. Hate driving at 80 to 90 kph so can't comment on economy if I went slower. Rig weighs about 2T but like I said it is very tall and towers over the back of the car. Really want to get a 'v' trailer to drop the boat lower and see what happens - suspect it is a big sail. It hurts when I talk to Crowie and see his boat which is physically longer and heavier and he gets much better mileage.
Apart from that a very good rig but with upgraded susp its a harsh ride when empty ( good ol' leaf rear). Had an issue with rear main went but apparently an issue Isuzu had for a while with bad seal batch - replaced and ok now. Installed bar work, 2" susp, winch, trans cooler, FWH and catch can - best result was free wheeling hubs - gained 0.8L/100 for $250. Getting 8.5L/100 around town.
Drove my brothers Ranger (last model 5cyl diesel) and was mightily impressed (more power than DMax) but was $12k more than my DMax so couldn't justify the expense. Also Ranger has a lot of electrics and communications in the wiring which worried me a bit when out bush - however you're stuffed in any car now if a sensor has a hissy fit.
Cheers
Moose
D_d_001
Posts: 1522
Date Joined: 09/03/13
Hey just curious when you tow
Hey just curious when you tow at 100kph what gear and what approx. revs are you doing?
crowie
Posts: 91
Date Joined: 16/11/14
Not stealing
the thread with moose but he can compare to me, when he replies too
I don't care as much as i should haha. if i think the road is flat enough to warrant 5th ( overdrive ) then il use it but if its all over the place il use 4th at 100kmh
4th does about 2300rpm @100
5th does about 1600 to 1700rpm @100
Towing the boat to esperence i got 16l per 100km and i put the chip in for the return trip and got 13l per 100. Both were in D, not me changing gears ( lazy ). I did go semi auto for the first 200km on the way down but went back to D after.
Any one know where i can get a dmax gearbox haha
D_d_001
Posts: 1522
Date Joined: 09/03/13
certainly appreciate the
certainly appreciate the feedback....13L /100 towing 2.5T is outstanding. my car only gets that just driving.
Guess it helps when the torque converter locks in all gears. (prob not 1st though)
what chip do you have ?
dodgy
Posts: 4584
Date Joined: 01/02/10
I looked at a dmax wit a
I looked at a dmax with a toasted gearbox that had been towing a large van. Turned me right off them. Bought a 200 instead.
Does anyone know where the love of god goes, when the waves turn the minutes to hours?
crowie
Posts: 91
Date Joined: 16/11/14
Same
Same model gearbox is used in the prado 150 series as the dmax.
dodgy
Posts: 4584
Date Joined: 01/02/10
Would be carefull with them
Would be carefull with them then. Had done less than 15000 and was slipping badly. Isuzu ute is renowned for being difficult with warranty issues and it was traded on something more suitable.
Does anyone know where the love of god goes, when the waves turn the minutes to hours?
crowie
Posts: 91
Date Joined: 16/11/14
Im out
Mine is out of warranty now anyways so il be paying through the nose if id does fuck out. Like i said previously ive smashed it towing the boat to esperance in 41 degree heat with the air con on full blast without a drama.... touch wood
crowie
Posts: 91
Date Joined: 16/11/14
ahh
I got it from a mob called race chip. I have however been told to remove it as it boosts the fuel rail pressure to unsafe pressures and it can throw and injector or worse. the harness is still plugged in but i have the blank in it at the moment. it has 9 adjustable settings and a good friend of mine has had his dyno'd with it in and got 151kw at the wheels which was good but fuel pressures were a bit alarming. it was done in 38 degree heat and the exhaust gas temp didnt go stupid either.
Deleted
Posts: 6265
Date Joined: 26/04/14
egr blank or module ( i have
egr blank or module ( i have module in 2010 colorado ) and remap ecu over a chip
win win
crowie
Posts: 91
Date Joined: 16/11/14
module
module it is. I have looked into it a bit further but now i spend all my money on fishing not the car haha
crano
Posts: 712
Date Joined: 04/11/09
ranger bt50
I am going through the process myself and I would not discount the BT50 as as yesterday I priced a Ranger and a BT50 and the BT50 was 9 grand cheaper.
D_d_001
Posts: 1522
Date Joined: 09/03/13
what sort of $ are you looking at ?
last time I priced a BT 50 1-2 weeks ago was just under $50k
crano
Posts: 712
Date Joined: 04/11/09
will PM you
will PM you
D_d_001
Posts: 1522
Date Joined: 09/03/13
for anyone who's
for anyone who's interested.
bit of an update. bought the Colorado 6sp Auto. in the end it came down to quite a few things. the Ranger when I went out and got the exact quotes was $13K more for pretty much the exact same features. (except it had a less "plastic" dash.) This represents 33% price difference for essentially the same thing!!! Whether the two are "comparable" is just an issue of opinion :)
The Ranger was certainly a nice car but in the end couldn't justify it. it seems the Ranger has gone the way of "Toyota" ....great product but you pay for the name. BTW the ford dealers were not going to do me any favours either. (FWIW BT50 wasn't far off the Ranger price)
test drove the Dmax and IMHO just didn't cut the power/ torque. for anyone who's interested ....here's an interesting torque comparison between the two.
http://autoexpert.com.au/buying-a-car/new-cars/qa/should-i-buy-isuzu-mu-x-or-holden-colorado-7-update
don't know how much of an "expert" this guy is but the overlayed torque curves are good to see. Obviously there are some very happy dmax drivers so certainly not putting down this car....all I can say is that when I drove the two (colorado and dmax) back to back the torque and power difference is substantial to say the least. (Colorado holds above 470NM between about 1800 and 2700rpm, same as ranger....but with a peak at 500nm at 2000rpm .)
this did factor into my decision a bit. reason I'm upgrading is the towability on my present car (STX navara) is borderline and didn't want to upgrade to still have the same probs
anyway had the vehicle for a while now and starting to tow. Absolutely fantastic ! Can easily sit in 5th gear on 95-100kph with pretty good fuel usage. ticks along at 2100ish rpm. 2T boat and more with the horse floats.
torque converter lock in 2nd to 6th. (navara didn't have this and was the biggest problem with the car).
Will I be happy long term ?... will I have probs?
who knows.. will deal with that if probs arise.
Cheers to everyone for imput all a help.
D_d_001
Posts: 1522
Date Joined: 09/03/13
bit of an update....for
bit of an update....for anyone who may be interested
towed the full rig up to Coral bay recently for the first big trip. only had the car 5 months. 7000kms on clock.
On the way up was a bit of a lead foot. but cruising back put the thing in cruise control (when it wasn't too hilly) and it just purred.
Am absolutely ecstatic with the ease of ride.
travelled in 5th manual mode (torque converter locked) (6 speed auto) with 2 ton boat fully loaded and the ute pretty full as well at about 95kmph.
Economy (although more on trip up) seemed to average about 14 litres per 100 but just seemed to get better and better. on the return trip gero to perth averaged 13.4 liters /100km (no noticable tail wind etc)
sitting on 95kmph (gps) 98 on the speedo. Edit : some of the gero to perth (north of Dongara) leg I was stuck behind a truck and travelled a bit slower which may have given me better economy.) Didn't put the full rig over weigh bridge but was pretty loaded.
at no point on the on the whole return trip to coral bay was I forced to change down a gear. (even though I did ...my usual instinct is to back off slightly when hitting a big hill and change down)
Torque on the colorado is fantastic.
95km/hr = 2000ish rpm in 5th gear.(standard tyres)
2000 rpm = peak torque and of course best economy.
gearbox fluid temps peaked at 92dg C when outside temps were 38 C but generally mid to highish 80's
economy was much better with cruise control on than I could possibly get to with my foot on the pedal
engine coolant temps better with cruise on (less fuel)
Oil levels seem exactly the same as before trip.
So far so good.
Dale
Posts: 7930
Date Joined: 13/09/05
Good recent reviews here on all the different Utes available.
http://www.caradvice.com.au/388419/ute-comparison-ford-ranger-v-holden-colorado-v-isuzu-d-max-v-mazda-bt-50-v-mitsubishi-triton-v-nissan-navara-v-toyota-hilux-v-volkswagen-amarok-2/?carousel_slot=2
"Just because you are a Character, Doesn't mean you have Character."
Mr Wolf
D_d_001
Posts: 1522
Date Joined: 09/03/13
cheers for that.
yeah I did read this b4 buying but in real life I just couldn't put much "weight" into the review. the tow test. (most important thing for me) in which most scored better than the Colorado was done with 750kg towed ????? might as well tow that with a camry. haha
would have liked to see them put 2.5T behind and make it a meaningful test
little johnny
Posts: 5362
Date Joined: 04/12/11
Some very good reads
In this lot. Reason little Andy selling his boat car and bike. Wants a ranger .. So which is best. Land cruiser way out of his reach.
D_d_001
Posts: 1522
Date Joined: 09/03/13
did see the boat for sale and
did see the boat for sale and wonder.
Couldn't tell you which is better but as I said further up the ranger was about 30% more $ for the same specs. test drove the Ranger and very much like the ride. It did seem more solid and a bit better put together but certainly at a cost.
I've not had anything go wrong with my Colorado or really anything I don't like about it but will put it up here if it does happen.
D_d_001
Posts: 1522
Date Joined: 09/03/13
update
Wife and daughter travelled up to Moora. about a 400km trip return from Byford. towed two horses in the float. est...1800kg plus ute packed.
Ave just under 12 litres /100. She travellers pretty slow with the horses but pretty good fuel consumption.
z00m
Posts: 1086
Date Joined: 10/05/14
Colorado
In January I bought a used 2013 Colorado 2wd for the towing capacity. My boat and trailer is just under 2T and the colorado makes it seem effortless. When I was towing it with the wife's Kluger you felt the weight of the boat all the time but with the Colorado it is an easier job of towing it. I don't do any offroading or beach launching so the 2wd was all I needed.